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Stingray V12 build....

193K views 536 replies 94 participants last post by  Marks76ray 
#1 ·
I've been working on this swap/rebuild/restoration a little over a year and ½....

Matt AKA DB- graciously asked me to bring the build over here- where I might get a little more appreciation or rather a perceptive recognition of the quality in the build rather than how sacrilegious it is...Heaven forbid an European Engine in a Corvette...Personally I think Duntov would dig it -
“Zora Arkus-Duntov was born in Belgium, raised in Leningrad, and educated in Berlin.
He brought his European automotive high-performance experience to bear on the just-introduced Corvette”

Here's what I'm placing between the frame rails...



A BMW V12 circa mid nineties- it's an all aluminum 60 degree with 322HP stock NET....10:1 compression-roller single overhead cam which weighs in around 500lbs.
Dimensionally it's about the same size as the LS5 that was originally in my car...but the "numbers matching" motor was long gone when I bought it in 1980....



 
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#6 ·
Richard, thanks for posting. I'm totally digging the project from start to finish and I can't wait to see more.

I agree, as will many others, this is an awesome project.

There will always be someone who doesn't agree with what you're doing but I just hope they can keep everything positive and try to respect all the hard work and imagination that goes into this project.

No room for a Negative Nancy in this thread. :thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:
 
#9 ·
Looks like a very ambitious but well-thought-out project. I wish you much luck with the endeavor. It will be worth it just to hear the exhaust note. :D

Just curious as to the weight of the BMW V-12 powertrian versus the stock Chevy 350?
 
#10 ·
A bare SBC iron block is around 180 lbs. Fully assembled with iron heads and iron intake it's nearing 575 lbs.

A fully dressed BMW V12 is a hair over 600 lbs. Now, knowing that Richard has killed a few of the accessories he may have dropped his V12 down to SBC weight.
 
#14 ·
Thanks for sharing with us. I like upgrading a c3, Chevy dropped the ball in the 70 s with barely enough power to get the Vette moving. This will be a interesting build and one to follow. A lot of people tell me I shouldn't put a 8.1L in my Vette because it is a truck engine, but I just smile and think about all that torque it produces. I've been thinking about naming my Vette torque monster, you'll have to come up with a name that fits the v12 thanks again :thumbsup: Mark
 
#17 ·
All I can say is WOW!.....in a good way. :D That is quite an ambitious project, and you seem to have what it takes to pull it off. Can't wait to see the final product! :thumbsup:
 
#18 ·
Anyone who is willing to build something that unique gets big points in my book. You're going where no one else has gone before. How difficult will it be to get the electronics working for something like this? It's obviously not something that Painless has a kit for...
I think it would be fun to build that motor for big power, but keep it muffled fairly well like it was in the BMW. It would surprise a lot of people with the power and sound.
 
#20 ·
Nah, open up the exhaust. That V-12 should sound sweet! (Supermarine Spitfire or Merlin powered P-51 maybe not..)
That will be quite a car when done! Are you going to adapt the OE computer, or go with a motec or megasquirt type system?
A few years ago at Funfest, a guy had his Lamborghini Countach on display. Being the petrolhead I am, I started poking around the engine bay and noted 2 gm ECMs. When I commented on that, the owner told me the origan computer flaked out. He called his local Lambo parts dealer for an estimate for a replacment, to which they replied, " no problem-It'll be 15." The owner said $1500.00, thats not too bad, to which the supplier replied no, $15000.00???!!? The owner went elsewhere and found a system that runs the car as 2 6 cylinders. It looked to be older ECMs so I guess it was a batch fire system rather than a sequential...
 
#22 ·
:partyon:Great build. I love unique projects like this. A friend and I often discuss what crazy combinations we would like to build if we could actually afford to. One project each is enough.:laughing:
To hell with the naysayers, there's plenty of original/factory restored cars of all brands out there, they don't all have to remain that way. I have no problem with those that prefer them that way, but let others do what they want with their own stuff as they see fit. When it comes to Corvettes in particular, there will always be factory cars around so as long as it's not some rare or overly significant model, why not make them interesting. Did Zora keep them stock? Hell no!:cheers:
 
#23 ·
WHY ON EARTH WOULD YOU DO THIS??????????????
-----------------CAUSE IT's DAMN AWESOME!


So cool, be sure to keep updating. Are you able to tweak the V12 for more power? it's 325 now.....what do you think the end will be pushing?

I love how they look in the engine bay.
 
#26 ·
Awesome. Can't wait to see further progress.

Like was previously said, I have mad respect for you guys that can turn an idea into a mechanical reality.
 
#28 ·
Thanks guys...

No one's gonna say I'm and idiot and it would be worth more stock??? Or my finish on the frame is way too glossy...and how many points am I'm gonna loose for that...

The new twin turbo V12 weighs in at a little over 600lbs....That's a bad ass motor ...but still costs about as much as a small house... 535 hp and 550 lb-ft..
Hmmmm...I just noticed it's a rear sump...that'd be a lot easier than modding the front sumped V12's I have now...



The predecessor V12 was basically two versions - (ok-discounting the McLaren F1 and the CSI motor)

First- M70 5liters Bosch electronics - 8:1 compression- the first car in the world w/ drive by wire (1988) rated at 296 HP and 330 ft/lb

Second generation- M73 5.4 liters Siemens electronics (OBD II) 10:1 compression rated at 326 HP and 361ft/lb torque
Both are pre-"VANOS" (from variable Nockenwellensteuerung- or variable valve timing) which makes things easier...

These V12's have their plus's but they are really hard to "hotrod" in the general sense...

To "bore" it out- you'll have to sleeve it- the bores are alusil and more than a hone you'll remove the finish and all bets are off. Remember w/ these engines, the cost factor is TIMES 12!!

Stroker Crank kits- well let's just say they are pricey at $4k....and that'll just get you to 6 liters....

Cam?? M73's are 'hollow' core - there are NO aftermarket cams...The M70 - "one" aftermarket cam- and a pair will run you about $3K...

Can't just "deck the block" where as the pistons are positive deck and you're gonna run into problems...

The M70 is great if you are going forced induction(low compression)- there are a few out there w/ 500-600HP w/ stock internals...and one guy in Sweden w/ one big ass turbo sporting over 1000hp.... (1249 to be exact...) STOCK INTERNALS!!!





I'm gonna do a combo of the M70 's electronics (OBD I- no cat needed) on the higher compression M73 engine -pull off it's air injector system and cats- which I think will sound better running through the sidepipes....I am looking at the electronic cutouts!!!



Before I pulled my first M70 V12 out of my other parts car- I sawzalled off the mufflers - and it sounded sweet!!! I also cut all the wires not needed and directly connected the throttle potentiometer directly under the hood and made sure everything worked . There are several kit car guys using this motor- and I read up on their forums on how to use the stock ECU's. Actually only six wires need to be connected to the car.

Here's the "throttle"



There are Megasquirts systems- GM V6 ( using two of them) and then there is the Motec at over $4k.. Initially, I'm gonna run the stock BMW stuff- I have the Dinan chips......till I figure out the next induction idea I'm working on....

So -in a nutshell....Stock the motor is 326HP- torque is almost a flat line from 1800RPM to 5000...chipping it -maybe 15 more....Dry sump (better sealing - vacuum ) a few more ponies...no cats... no accessories...open - low restriction exhaust... I might see 350...but again - I'm sort like the guy putting the supercharger on the flathead Ford and thinking 250HP is magic....

It's not all about the HP- any "tool" can spend the money and have 600 HP easy for under 5 figures these days...but few can say they have a V12!

Richard
 
#45 ·
So -in a nutshell....Stock the motor is 326HP- torque is almost a flat line from 1800RPM to 5000...chipping it -maybe 15 more....Dry sump (better sealing - vacuum ) a few more ponies...no cats... no accessories...open - low restriction exhaust... I might see 350...but again - I'm sort like the guy putting the supercharger on the flathead Ford and thinking 250HP is magic....

It's not all about the HP- any "tool" can spend the money and have 600 HP easy for under 5 figures these days...but few can say they have a V12!

Richard
Awesome...slap a turbo or supercharger on there and then your in the running. :spanked:
 
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