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Old 11-29-2012, 10:24 AM   #16
diehrd
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Originally Posted by TheMelkMan View Post
You were the one making the baseless claim that Obama won the election because of people on federal aid... if that were true, then Obama would've won states like Oklahoma, Louisiana, Kentucky and Arizona in a landslide... and he would've lost states like New York, Illinois, New Jersey, etc.

I feel a bit like Karl Pilkington as "Bullshit Man" in this thread
This is a statement based on zero knowledge of NY , Take away straight welfare and look at entitlements such as free healthcare free lunches free collage free dental free optical and the list goes on and on , here in NY the biggest takers are the family who fall below some crazy % of poverty. WHish is set at a level high enough to secure votes and maintain a democrat majority on the LIE costs of services are high because of corporate greed .

Last year the feds spent 1 trillion on welfare entitlements , yes thats a fact 1 trillion and most of that goes to programs that are what I stated above, Ask a liberal and they will say but the children ohhh my the children ,, well stop making kids , live life in order of education , carer and marriage and then kids .. try that out see how many hungry kids exist then and depend on the working class to pay a tax to feed them.
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Old 11-29-2012, 10:33 AM   #17
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I have to agree with melkman here. The pubs just keep looking for ways to deny that what they are selling....well just isn't selling. If you truly want to understand why the pubs lost, look at the demographics. They lost with women...Why??? Because of very backward ideas about the abortion issue. They lost with immigrants...Why??? Because of some very backward ideas about immigrants. They lost young people...why??? Because of very backward ideas about gays.

What is the one thread here....social policy. The republicans always used to win with fiscal issues. Then they made their big push toward social issues and Bush proved that the pubs no longer held the upperhand in fiscal responsability, while pushing hard on social issues, and we have what we now have. An unelectable and broken party.
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Old 11-29-2012, 10:44 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMelkMan View Post
You were the one making the baseless claim that Obama won the election because of people on federal aid... if that were true, then Obama would've won states like Oklahoma, Louisiana, Kentucky and Arizona in a landslide... and he would've lost states like New York, Illinois, New Jersey, etc.

I feel a bit like Karl Pilkington as "Bullshit Man" in this thread
He won it because of the large population centers and the typically very large number of "entitled" people in those centers. You keep talking about states, but states are not homogeneous in their voting patterns. Across the country, large population centers went for Obama, and almost everywhere else went for Romney.
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Old 11-29-2012, 10:51 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by the machine View Post
I have to agree with melkman here. The pubs just keep looking for ways to deny that what they are selling....well just isn't selling. If you truly want to understand why the pubs lost, look at the demographics. They lost with women...Why??? Because of very backward ideas about the abortion issue. They lost with immigrants...Why??? Because of some very backward ideas about immigrants. They lost young people...why??? Because of very backward ideas about gays.

What is the one thread here....social policy. The republicans always used to win with fiscal issues. Then they made their big push toward social issues and Bush proved that the pubs no longer held the upperhand in fiscal responsability, while pushing hard on social issues, and we have what we now have. An unelectable and broken party.
Just remember, when you sink with the current elected crop of Democrates I hope you take the time to pause and reflect on that taste We who didn't vote Democtate already dislike the taste and the large helping of shit sandwich is comming
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Old 11-29-2012, 10:56 AM   #20
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I have to agree with melkman here. The pubs just keep looking for ways to deny that what they are selling....well just isn't selling.
Well, it's selling in the red areas of this 2012 election map. Face it. We have a country nearly evenly divided on two opposing visions. It doesn't fall along state lines or gender lines. It falls along the lines of high density populations vs. lower denstity populations. People in the vast non-urban part of the country believe in self-sufficiency. Where would our country be without the level of welfare we now have? (New government redefinition of poverty is roughly $40k/yr). Well, families would be taking more responsibility for their needy members as was done for the first 200 years of our country. When grandma needs medical care and home care, in the old days, families stepped up. They lived at a little lower standard so they could take care of the ones who couldn't take care of themselves. The people in urban centers want to push that off on the community so they don't have to mess with it. That's the difference in that 20% of the map that is blue and the 80% that is red.

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Old 11-29-2012, 03:23 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Texdentist View Post
Well, it's selling in the red areas of this 2012 election map. Face it. We have a country nearly evenly divided on two opposing visions. It doesn't fall along state lines or gender lines. It falls along the lines of high density populations vs. lower denstity populations. People in the vast non-urban part of the country believe in self-sufficiency. Where would our country be without the level of welfare we now have? (New government redefinition of poverty is roughly $40k/yr). Well, families would be taking more responsibility for their needy members as was done for the first 200 years of our country. When grandma needs medical care and home care, in the old days, families stepped up. They lived at a little lower standard so they could take care of the ones who couldn't take care of themselves. The people in urban centers want to push that off on the community so they don't have to mess with it. That's the difference in that 20% of the map that is blue and the 80% that is red.

Tex the only person you are fooling is yourself. Population centers only represent more people, in a concentrated area. And while those places broke in large numbers for Obama, other more rural areas did not go for Romney in very large numbers. The result is...congardulations president Obama. Lets not forget Tex that Obama won both the Electoral vote and the popular vote. So regardless of where they live the majority of people voted for Obama.

I have seen plenty of rural poor who live off of welfare. Apalacia is the capital of welfare today and it is some of the most rural area there is. The poorest state in the Union Mississippi, has no large population centers, but has the highest number of welfare recipients.
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Old 11-29-2012, 05:46 PM   #22
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He won it because of the large population centers and the typically very large number of "entitled" people in those centers. You keep talking about states, but states are not homogeneous in their voting patterns. Across the country, large population centers went for Obama, and almost everywhere else went for Romney.
I keep talking about states because that's how our electoral system works, and that's how federal money is doled out. The federal government transfers money at the state level, not based on voting districts.

You keep trying to make a correlation between people receiving government money and Obama winning the election, but the facts say otherwise. The states Romney won are the states that take the most money from the federal government. Those are simple, verifiable facts.
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Old 11-29-2012, 06:22 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by the machine View Post
If your gonna inject facts into this conversation, things are gonna get quiet real fast.

Nice post.

I love the economist...best news source out, in my oppinion.
I can believe the other 2 yankers can't do simple math, but you too?

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Fascism is a religion of the state. It assumes the organic unity of the body politic and longs for a national leader attuned to the will of the people. It is totalitarian in that it views everything as political and holds that any action by the state is justified to achieve the common good. It takes responsibility for all aspects of life, including our health and well-being, and seeks to impose uniformity of thought and action, whether by force or through regulation and social pressure. Everything, including economy and religion, must be aligned with its objectives.
Old 11-29-2012, 07:48 PM   #24
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looks to me you have enough hate to go around
Hey mang!
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