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Old 01-31-2013, 05:58 PM   #16
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mmmm... Weight savings and GM just don't jive. Guess the electronics get it to 60 under 4 secs or the LT1 will be making more(475ish maybe) than what has been quoted. But than again GM has a rep for overstating 0-60 performance too.
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Old 01-31-2013, 05:58 PM   #17
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It was Motor Trend and it was 60% with the roof in and 20% with the roof out.

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...ay_first_look/
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Old 01-31-2013, 06:03 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadkillz View Post
If they really wanted a plushmobile then they should have just brought back the XLR......

Let the Corvette be the sports car and let the XLR be the GT....


I guess to be fair, we need to wait and see the road test results, but whatever they are, the added weight will always make us question if it wouldn't have performed better if Tadge had kept his eye on the weight target like Hill and Wallace did before him.

Another possibility: The Z?? might loose the AFM and revert to an aluminum center box tunnel plus Al or even CF torque tube. Add all CF body panels, loose much of the insulation and the Z?? might be a couple of hundred pounds less than the Stingray.

Regardless, the Stingray starting point is just way too weight high.
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Old 01-31-2013, 06:11 PM   #19
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Quote:
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mmmm... Weight savings and GM just don't jive. Guess the electronics get it to 60 under 4 secs or the LT1 will be making more(475ish maybe) than what has been quoted. But than again GM has a rep for overstating 0-60 performance too.
Go read All Corvettes Are Red. Dave Hill developed the, then revolutionary C5 chassis while driving a constant awareness of the weight impact of every nut and bolt in that car. Obviously, Wallace built on that mentality with the even lighter C6.

Tadge was either saddled with unwanted requirements or chose them but really blew it. As Chief Engineer it was his responsibility to stand his ground and say "NO" when there was an unacceptable impact on the C7 - regardless of whether it was an unworkable ARM or a Fugly rear fascia. The buck stops with Tadge.
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Old 01-31-2013, 06:37 PM   #20
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I just think that the interior complaints over the years cost him alot of weight because GM decided this was gonna be the vette that feels like a million bucks on the inside regardless of the consequences. I think that is why we are seeing carbon fiber in the base car. That was the only way to keep weight down.
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Old 01-31-2013, 07:25 PM   #21
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Quote:
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Go read All Corvettes Are Red. Dave Hill developed the, then revolutionary C5 chassis while driving a constant awareness of the weight impact of every nut and bolt in that car. Obviously, Wallace built on that mentality with the even lighter C6.

Tadge was either saddled with unwanted requirements or chose them but really blew it. As Chief Engineer it was his responsibility to stand his ground and say "NO" when there was an unacceptable impact on the C7 - regardless of whether it was an unworkable ARM or a Fugly rear fascia. The buck stops with Tadge.
What drives me crazy is the focus on weight reduction for the C7 was even greater then that of the C6. Yet they seemed to have countered all of that by turning the Corvette into a GT.

I don't doubt that the car will perform amazingly, 0-60 in 3.9 seconds with 1G of cornering in the skid pad. Though I think we all will look at the car and wonder how much faster would it have been if it was 3,100 pounds or even 3,000 pounds.

At the end of the day, while this is a performance car it needs to do well in other areas in and not just in performance. I guess whats good for sales should make everyone who is a fan of the brand happy. A good example of this is the Cadillac ATS vs the BMW 3 series, from all of the reviews the ATS drives circles around the BMW 3 series. The 3 series has gone more up market and lost some of its edge, yet I don't think anyone expects the new ATS to out sell the 3 series out of the door.

I hope that they ditch the GT notion with the Z06 and go all out insane, with increase use of carbon fiber they need to get to it 3,000 pounds to make up for the C7s weight.
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Old 01-31-2013, 08:40 PM   #22
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I may have missed this, but has an official weight number been released or is the weight conversation above merely speculation?
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Old 01-31-2013, 11:27 PM   #23
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Car and Driver interview quotes:
Juechter:
Quote:
3000 lbs is not practical...requirements offset mass savings elsewhere.
Ed Moss:
Quote:
The center tunnel is...completely redesigned....heavier than today's aluminum car. ... latch a roof to a C7...compare to [C6]Z06...it's 50% stiffer.
Mike Bailey:
Quote:
C7 has 35% more brake swept than base C6. C7 Z51 has 6% more ...than C6 Z06. ...dual cast rotor ...Aluminum center web cast iron outer with slots [drill holes experienced breakage]. Guys who run mules at VIR are getting lap times competitive with [C6] Z06.
Quote:
Specifications:
Price (estimated) $55,000
Power (estimated) 450HP @ 6000
Torque (estimated) 450lb-ft @ 4200
Wheelbase....106.7 in
Length.........177.0 in
Width............73.9 in
Height...........48.6 in
Weight.......3350-3450 lb
Please note that the weight is NOT indicated as "estimated" as with the unknown elements on the table.
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Old 02-01-2013, 12:55 AM   #24
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lap times competitive with C6 Z06 is very promising, I am guessing not the Z06 with comp. wheels and tires though.

Still though, the early C6 Z06 started at $65,000 and pulled around 1G on a skid pad (slightly over in some test and slightly under in others). It is easy to see how the Z51 C7 can be competitive with early Z06 even though its down a good amount of horsepower and up a good amount of weight.

For the person asking, there has yet to be an official weight release however I think most of us are coming to the conclusion that 3,300 pounds is highly likely. While not in its own right a bad weight I (and others) question the move as it seems as though Tadge wanted this car to be more of a GT and less of a sports car.
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Old 02-01-2013, 11:48 AM   #25
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GM is using the ZL1 type "magic"to put power down more effectively with this car. I think we all knew that was coming.
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Old 02-01-2013, 01:30 PM   #26
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I still think the HP will be closer to 490ish.
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Old 02-01-2013, 05:02 PM   #27
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I still think the HP will be closer to 490ish.
I dunno, I personally kind of doubt that. I agree that they're possibly being coy about the true HP numbers, but I don't think we're going to see that much of an improvement over what they've already announced (but it's true that they've said at least 450 HP and 450 lb-ft, which makes me think the final numbers might be slightly higher). I'd think at most we'll see 460-465 HP, if we're lucky... but I wouldn't get my hopes up.

Also, I don't doubt the possibility that all the new stuff wiped out any weight savings, but I think the 3,350 lbs number is a bit high. Like you mentioned earlier, that would require more than 300lbs of new weight to counter act the weight savings we already know about. But even if the car is 3,350 lbs, and the final HP number is exactly 450, that's a power-to-weight ratio that's almost identical to the current car (actually even better, just slightly). With all of the other improvements (more rigid chassis, better interior, launch control, etc.), having the same power-to-weight ratio as the current car isn't the end of the world for me.

My guess is that if the car is heavier, I doubt it's going to be much more than 50 lbs heavier than the current car. If that's the case, then the power/weight ratio will be higher than the current car and I'll be satisfied.
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Old 02-01-2013, 05:20 PM   #28
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What I really wanna know is if the drive train is going to be made of glass like it is in the C5 and C6. It is really disheartening knowing that I have to drop around $2000+ just to know I won't grenade my diff on sticky street radials or ANY drag type tire.
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Old 02-01-2013, 07:04 PM   #29
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I dunno, I personally kind of doubt that. I agree that they're possibly being coy about the true HP numbers, but I don't think we're going to see that much of an improvement over what they've already announced (but it's true that they've said at least 450 HP and 450 lb-ft, which makes me think the final numbers might be slightly higher). I'd think at most we'll see 460-465 HP, if we're lucky... but I wouldn't get my hopes up.
Absolutely agree. A jump to 490 would be unprecidented behavior from GM and might even be percieved by some as not really knowing what's going on in their own development group. I think 460 would be the upper limit of their final number. My bet is that they've completed or are in the process of certifying the engine and drive train, so they can't be playing around with tuning more HP out of it. It's just a matter of dynoing the final, approved, passed certification package and reading the numbers.
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Old 02-01-2013, 09:17 PM   #30
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IMO if it gains more than 100 lbs with an AL frame they absolutely blew it. That would actually disgust me. And the car is longer overall and has a longer wheelbase. Totally wrong direction for the car in this fan's opinion. Having said that CF on the base car can't be cost effective and shouldn't be necessary. Instead I would have just ditched the variable displacement BS. Fuel economy is very important in 2014 but you can't counteract the whole point of the car -- performance and emotion!!
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