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Old 12-02-2012, 12:51 PM   #1
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Bought my first gun.... Officially

A while back, I have a friend that was in need due to a divorce and he sold his glock 21 acp 45. I keep it loaded beside the bed in a special night stand that I had custom made that has a secret drawer above the top visible drawer.

So a couple weeks ago, this same friend invited me to go to a gun show in downtown Houston. I am not a hugh gun fan so this is my first gun show. I went not intending to buy anything but that did not last long. We were walking around when I came across a dealer, the only one there that had a Kriss 45 ACP. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KRISS_Vector

My friend talked me into it because the mag for the Glock 21 fits this gun as well. What surprised me was how easy it was to buy a gun. It was like buying a sandwich at subway or a bottle of whiskey at the liquor store. I gave him the money and my ID, they typed some things into a computer and Wa La, I just bought a gun. The whole transaction took about 5 minutes. So now I am an owner of a gun that is classified as a submachine gun. This surprised the hell out of me because knowing very little about guns, that regular citizens can go out and purchase such weapons. I knew nothing of the gun before I bought it other than it used the same clip as my glock.
The other amazing thing IMO was I was able to buy 300 rounds just two rows down not 5 minutes later while walking around with the gun.

Later that day we went to go shoot this thing, and I must say it is a breeze to shoot. Because of the unique way the recoil works, even with a 45 caliber bullet I am able to hold my sight alignment while firing the trigger as fast as I can with very little effort and no muzzle rise.

The whole thing was definitely a unique experience for someone that has never been.
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Old 12-02-2012, 03:34 PM   #2
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If you have a clean record and the system is not overly busy, it only takes a few minuets for the background check to go through. Modern technology is great. If you got the one with the select fire (semi and full auto capabilities) then yes it is classified as a sub-machine gun. If it is semi-auto only, then no, it is NOT a sub-machine gun. If it does have the select fire, you need a class 3 license to own that, and it looks pretty obvious you don't and therefore would be in violation of Federal firearms laws. This is important to reiterate; regular citizens can NOT buy sub-machine guns. If this is the case, then yeah, there was some shadiness going on with your deal. Since you said "while firing the trigger as fast as I can," I'm guessing it is not, in which case, there is no issue; just please don't go around saying you bought a sub-machine gun with no problem, because that just freaks people out and gives the gun grabbers more "ammo" of their own. And the gun grabbers don't care if their "ammo" is based on a misunderstanding; they use anything and everything they can, regardless of the truthfulness of their information.
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Old 12-02-2012, 03:52 PM   #3
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If you have a clean record and the system is not overly busy, it only takes a few minuets for the background check to go through. Modern technology is great. If you got the one with the select fire (semi and full auto capabilities) then yes it is classified as a sub-machine gun. If it is semi-auto only, then no, it is NOT a sub-machine gun. If it does have the select fire, you need a class 3 license to own that, and it looks pretty obvious you don't and therefore would be in violation of Federal firearms laws. This is important to reiterate; regular citizens can NOT buy sub-machine guns. If this is the case, then yeah, there was some shadiness going on with your deal. Since you said "while firing the trigger as fast as I can," I'm guessing it is not, in which case, there is no issue; just please don't go around saying you bought a sub-machine gun with no problem, because that just freaks people out and gives the gun grabbers more "ammo" of their own. And the gun grabbers don't care if their "ammo" is based on a misunderstanding; they use anything and everything they can, regardless of the truthfulness of their information.
Your right, I had to read a little more to understand the difference. As stated before, I am kind of a noob when it comes to guns, with the exception of the M16 I had to sleep with during boot camp.

Thanks for the heads up.

One thing I did see at the gun show I was not too happy with, there was an AR that had green zombies painted all over it. It made the gun look like a toy. A kid might mistake it for a toy. A weapon should look like a weapon and not something cute or something that might be mistaken for a toy. I think the whole zombie apocalypse is comical but not in this case.
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Old 12-02-2012, 04:03 PM   #4
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One thing I did see at the gun show I was not too happy with, there was an AR that had green zombies painted all over it. It made the gun look like a toy. A kid might mistake it for a toy. A weapon should look like a weapon and not something cute or something that might be mistaken for a toy. I think the whole zombie apocalypse is comical but not in this case.
Yeah, that is a bad idea. It goes both ways though, some toys look so real that if the little red tip breaks off, you can't tell it's a toy from ten feet away without looking closely. Could and has lead to an accidental/mistaken identity shooting if in public.
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Old 12-02-2012, 07:30 PM   #5
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Welcome to the United States of America, where law abiding citizens can buy firearms as they please. 236 years and counting.
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Old 12-02-2012, 09:52 PM   #6
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Actually you can own full-auto arms. You can own almost anything really. It just a matter of paperwork and money. They BATF and FBI background checks are also mandatory. Supressors can be owned as well.

I talked with an FBI agent a few months ago, you'd be surprised at what you can legally own. As someone who enjoy firearms, I'm glad that we have that right.

Didn't take long after the tradegy in KC before idiots started making dumb comments. Bob Costas, who imho is always saying something stupid, read the comments of another writer which clearly "smelled" of anti-gun language. It basically said that if guns weren't so readily avail, then no one would have died. HUH?? As if the writer had a crystal ball and could read the events of an alternate "past".


I certainly believe that in some cases, it is easier to pull a trigger, but the right of all people to protect themselves from criminals (whether private citizen or govt. official) is a basic right that must be protected.

Last edited by c6vettedude; 12-03-2012 at 08:08 AM.
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Old 12-03-2012, 07:26 AM   #7
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c6vettedude is correct. Law abiding citizens can own just about anything up to and including tanks and artillery.

I own a number of NFA regulated arms (suppressor, short barrel rifle, short barrel shotgun, select fire rifle, sub-gun) . Buying them is easy, but expensive. With a clean record, and an agreeable local law enforcement chief, the only challenge is the money.

I own several high-end semi-auto AR-15 rifles that cost in the neighborhood of $2k each. I own one select fire M16 with the third safety position (full auto), which cost just south of $15K, and took 3 months to transfer. Supressors are not expensive as they are still making them, but the ATF paperwork and wait is about the same.

A friend of mine has a 20MM, which is considered a destructive device. More paperwork, wait, and money.

Most people are completely unaware of the rights we have as citizens or the limitations of government. There should be an app for that!
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Old 12-03-2012, 07:39 AM   #8
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There should be an app for that!
So true, since there's an app for just about everything else.

This summer I'm getting a PTR-91, which is the HK-91 clone. I'm getting a supressor for it as well. I'd like to get an original HK, but my budget will be tight since I'm doing some major upgrades this spring on the vette.

I'm also getting another AK-47. The last one I owned was made in Romania. I was impressed with the tight "groupings" that I got right out of the box.

Last edited by c6vettedude; 12-03-2012 at 08:11 AM.
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Old 12-03-2012, 08:34 AM   #9
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Congrats on your purchase. Should be a fun gun to own.
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Old 12-03-2012, 09:44 AM   #10
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c6vettedude is correct. Law abiding citizens can own just about anything up to and including tanks and artillery.

I own a number of NFA regulated arms (suppressor, short barrel rifle, short barrel shotgun, select fire rifle, sub-gun) . Buying them is easy, but expensive. With a clean record, and an agreeable local law enforcement chief, the only challenge is the money.

I own several high-end semi-auto AR-15 rifles that cost in the neighborhood of $2k each. I own one select fire M16 with the third safety position (full auto), which cost just south of $15K, and took 3 months to transfer. Supressors are not expensive as they are still making them, but the ATF paperwork and wait is about the same.

A friend of mine has a 20MM, which is considered a destructive device. More paperwork, wait, and money.

Most people are completely unaware of the rights we have as citizens or the limitations of government. There should be an app for that!
Sounds like an expensive hobby!
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Old 12-03-2012, 10:24 AM   #11
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Sounds like an expensive hobby!
Kinda like owning a Vette. And then there is owning a fast C3 Vette.
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Old 12-03-2012, 10:43 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by c6vettedude View Post

Didn't take long after the tradegy in KC before idiots started making dumb comments. Bob Costas, who imho is always saying something stupid, read the comments of another writer which clearly "smelled" of anti-gun language. It basically said that if guns weren't so readily avail, then no one would have died. HUH?? As if the writer had a crystal ball and could read the events of an alternate "past".


I certainly believe that in some cases, it is easier to pull a trigger, but the right of all people to protect themselves from criminals (whether private citizen or govt. official) is a basic right that must be protected.
Guns dont make killing easier, they just make it less messy.

I am sure the guy being a football player could have wrapped his hands around her neck quite easily and killed her that way. Then instead of shooting himself he could have gotten in a high speed chasing then ending his own life by T boning a wall or possibly getting in a wreck and taking other people with him in the process.

One of the most violent sports in the world and you are going to whine about gun control.
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Old 12-03-2012, 10:56 AM   #13
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Sounds like an expensive hobby!
No doubt. It is my passion. If I put my gun budget into cars....

On the OP's purchase, the operating system of the Kriss Vector was designed to all but eliminate the muzzle climb common to full auto firing of the .45 ACP cartridge. Anyone who has fired a Thompson on rock-n-roll knows that by the end of the 20 round magazine, you are shooting over your target. The Kriss action directs the recoil energy downward instead of upward. The gun was originally designed to have a pistol length barrel, and a four-position safety allowing semi, 2 round burst, and full auto.

In order to make the gun legal for transfer outside of NFA, they offer the model the OP likely purchased. 16" barrel (anything less would be an SBR) and a two position safety (semi-auto, safe).

The Kriss definitely has a cool factor because it looks and operates differently than the average carbine, but the civilian legal version is kind of like a ZR1 with a Cavalier engine in it. Guns are like cars. To each his own!
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Old 12-03-2012, 11:19 AM   #14
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If you got the one with the select fire (semi and full auto capabilities) then yes it is classified as a sub-machine gun. If it is semi-auto only, then no, it is NOT a sub-machine gun. If it does have the select fire, you need a class 3 license to own that, and it looks pretty obvious you don't and therefore would be in violation of Federal firearms laws. This is important to reiterate; regular citizens can NOT buy sub-machine guns.
Not entirely true. You need a class 3 license to deal in automatic firearms but if you purchase one all it takes is for the seller to pay the tax, and a background check to make sure the weapon is legal to sell and you're legal to own it. When you receive the paperwork there will be a "tax stamp" on it and that means that you may own it and that the seller may sell it.

Just fill out a NFA form 4, pay 200 bucks and get your county Sheriff to sign it and you're good to go.

Don't take your new weapon across state lines without filing paperwork with ATF.

Don't loan your automatic to a friend or even keep it at his house.

Several other rules apply but really just be careful.

As mentioned earlier, you can own just about anything you want as long as you have the bucks and no baddies on your record.
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Old 12-03-2012, 02:23 PM   #15
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Not entirely true. You need a class 3 license to deal in automatic firearms but if you purchase one all it takes is for the seller to pay the tax, and a background check to make sure the weapon is legal to sell and you're legal to own it. When you receive the paperwork there will be a "tax stamp" on it and that means that you may own it and that the seller may sell it.

Just fill out a NFA form 4, pay 200 bucks and get your county Sheriff to sign it and you're good to go.

Don't take your new weapon across state lines without filing paperwork with ATF.

Don't loan your automatic to a friend or even keep it at his house.

Several other rules apply but really just be careful.

As mentioned earlier, you can own just about anything you want as long as you have the bucks and no baddies on your record.
So class 3 is for selling and trading; not buying? Huh. I've been messing with this hobby (no where near the extent of my car addiction though) since I was 12, and never knew that. I've even had serious collectors, dealers, and class 3 holders tell me what I said earlier. Well, I guess I better up my game then. But in general, because of all the extra paperwork (especially the Sheriff's signature) and fees (taxes), a regular schmo can't just walk in and get one. Thanks for clarifying for me, you learn something new every day.
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