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Thread: Another LS3, T-56 swap into 1981 C3 Reply to Thread
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Topic Review (Newest First)
10-21-2019 10:29 PM
zimmej51
Quote:
Originally Posted by 7TRoadster View Post
Sorry Zim,

The wiring diagrams I did on mine were 1970. There may be some stuff that is the same but your year has more of the electronic do dads that mine doesn't.

Yeah, I have quite a bit of tech data on the wiring and don't anticipate too many problems, especially since there are a lot of mods to the electrical system anyway. But I did run across 2 things that might be worth sharing.


A while back I ordered a laminated print of the entire wiring diagram on one poster sized sheet. I thought it might be handy to see the whole thing at once, plus the ad said it was in color. But when I got it it was in color alright: All blue! The wiring color codes were printed by the wire but the print is fuzzy and hard to read. Just to make sure it wasn't my eyes that were fuzzy I had my son take a look at it and yep, it's fuzzy! It didn't cost much so it was no big deal. Probably will still be handy.


The other thing is the factory service manual reprint that I ordered a couple years ago. It looks just like the original. In fact I have an original Service Manual for the 1982 that I bought back in 1982. The manuals have the schematics for the sub-systems printed out in colors that match the actual wiring. Before I took my 81 all apart I was troubleshooting the power windows and something about the schematics in the 81 reprint manual just wasn't making any sense.



Then I noticed that the reprint manual just used grey scales in the electrical section instead of actual color like the original manual. So I got out the original 82 service manual and flipped to the same window section (the 81 and 82 manual are virtually identical except for the Cross Fire circuits) and there it was: The yellow wires did not print in the reprint version anywhere! Once I figured that out everything fell into place. Thought I'd mention that JIC anyone is using a reprint manual, it's not a huge deal provided you know that any yellow wires will not show up in the reprint.


Cheers to all!
10-21-2019 07:21 PM
7TRoadster Sorry Zim,

The wiring diagrams I did on mine were 1970. There may be some stuff that is the same but your year has more of the electronic do dads that mine doesn't.
10-21-2019 06:48 PM
zimmej51
Oh it's wiring time again.....

Uhhh.... Anyone remember where all this stuff plugs in??

10-20-2019 02:09 PM
autowiz
Quote:
Originally Posted by blueday View Post
Again great looking work.

10-20-2019 11:43 AM
blueday
Quote:
Originally Posted by autowiz View Post
Alright. We need to walk this conversation back just a bit. We order 2-6 radiators from DeWitts every single month for the last ~9 years. Sometimes for a C2, Sometimes for a C6, Sometimes with the engine oil cooler(EOC), Sometimes in black ice. We had one a few years back that came to us with a hole in the box and it was damaged in shipping and we had to return it. That is THE ONLY problem we have experienced with a company we have been doing a great deal of business with for many years. Slag in a threaded hole sucks. But it happens. And to damn a good name brand because of an unremoved piece of flash?
Slow down dude, i never damned dewitts. This was just a heads up for Zim. That same radiator is in my c3 and it seems to work ok after i cleaned up threads and flushed everthing. It didn't fix my overheating issue. I work hard for my money (just as you and others do I'm sure) and when i spend 640 for a radiator hell yeah I do have high expectations. I could've chosen to get a much lower priced champion or others for a much lower cost. I'm not going to go into the other issues i had dealing straight through them. Not my thread.

Back to you Zim. Again great looking work.

Ryan
10-20-2019 11:26 AM
zimmej51
Quote:
Originally Posted by autowiz View Post
Alright. We need to walk this conversation back just a bit. We order 2-6 radiators from DeWitts every single month for the last ~9 years. Sometimes for a C2, Sometimes for a C6, Sometimes with the engine oil cooler(EOC), Sometimes in black ice. We had one a few years back that came to us with a hole in the box and it was damaged in shipping and we had to return it. That is THE ONLY problem we have experienced with a company we have been doing a great deal of business with for many years. Slag in a threaded hole sucks. But it happens. And to damn a good name brand because of an unremoved piece of flash?

And what is this about F body? Corvettes are Y bodies. I think before I started looking to re engineer my core support for a steam vent, maybe I might just add one of these to the upper hose and connect it to the steam vent coming off the valley:
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/i...8aAg3dEALw_wcB

Then you can run whatever radiator you want. Hell keep your current radiator. But at least you wont be trying to force something in your car that was made to fit a completely different car.

Whoa, easy there! Anytime I hear of problems with $$$ parts the first thing I want to know is it one in ten or one in ten-thousand. You have helped answer that question and I do appreciate your input. DeWitt is still very much on my probable list. As far as the F-body thing, was just running down another of those many rumors running around, most of which turn out not to be fact. Personally, I'm not that fond of OEM radiator swaps - they aren't that good in the first place!


Thanks again,
10-20-2019 10:24 AM
autowiz
Quote:
Originally Posted by zimmej51 View Post
I'll have a chance to check out the F body thing. Hated to hear that the Dewitts rad had those kind of problems. They are still on my list of "possibles" for a new radiator but it makes me want to look a little harder for suitable alternatives. Aggravating to pay that kind of money for something you have to fix before you can use it!
Alright. We need to walk this conversation back just a bit. We order 2-6 radiators from DeWitts every single month for the last ~9 years. Sometimes for a C2, Sometimes for a C6, Sometimes with the engine oil cooler(EOC), Sometimes in black ice. We had one a few years back that came to us with a hole in the box and it was damaged in shipping and we had to return it. That is THE ONLY problem we have experienced with a company we have been doing a great deal of business with for many years. Slag in a threaded hole sucks. But it happens. And to damn a good name brand because of an unremoved piece of flash?

And what is this about F body? Corvettes are Y bodies. I think before I started looking to re engineer my core support for a steam vent, maybe I might just add one of these to the upper hose and connect it to the steam vent coming off the valley:
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/i...8aAg3dEALw_wcB

Then you can run whatever radiator you want. Hell keep your current radiator. But at least you wont be trying to force something in your car that was made to fit a completely different car.
10-19-2019 10:36 PM
zimmej51
Quote:
Originally Posted by blueday View Post
I can't confirm the fbody radaitor/fan setup but i have read the same thing.

As far as the dewitts ls radiator is concerned. I've been dealing with my ls3 overheating (225-230*) while idling for 30 + minutes w/ac on and 95* out. After ruling out all other cheap fix options i forked out money for spal fans but had the same results (I've had ford focus fans for years). Decided on the lsx radiator from dewitts which has the same tube size as my regular dewitts radiator but was a dual pass with the steam line. No change there either. I've started to put some heat shields one the headers and thing to vent out the engine bay. Seems like fall is here now so it'll have to wait til next summer to test high temps.

I wasnt as impressed with the quality of dewitts this time around. One threaded bung had a weld bead in/on it (i had to run a tap through to clean threads) and the threads still had metal in it that wasnt cleaned out. Very sad for the cost of the product.

Also, summitt has much better pricing than the actual manufacturer. It was like pulling teeth to get the manufacturer to refund me $30.

Great looking work as usual! Very impressive!

Hi Bluday, thanks for the info, good to know. I'm probably a month or 2 out before I will be to the radiator stage so I'll have a chance to check out the F body thing. Hated to hear that the Dewitts rad had those kind of problems. They are still on my list of "possibles" for a new radiator but it makes me want to look a little harder for suitable alternatives. Aggravating to pay that kind of money for something you have to fix before you can use it!
10-19-2019 09:39 AM
blueday
Quote:
Originally Posted by zimmej51 View Post
I have a question that I could use a hand with. Pretty soon I'm going to have to pre-fit a radiator before final assembly. I was planning on using a Dewitt P/N 6139077M . That is a natural finish (aluminum) and manual transmission item.


I've been told that an OEM radiator/fan assembly from a 1998 - 2002 F body will fit with little or no modification. There is a very significant price difference between the two.



Can anyone out there confirm the fit of the F-body radiator into the late model C3?

I can't confirm the fbody radaitor/fan setup but i have read the same thing.

As far as the dewitts ls radiator is concerned. I've been dealing with my ls3 overheating (225-230*) while idling for 30 + minutes w/ac on and 95* out. After ruling out all other cheap fix options i forked out money for spal fans but had the same results (I've had ford focus fans for years). Decided on the lsx radiator from dewitts which has the same tube size as my regular dewitts radiator but was a dual pass with the steam line. No change there either. I've started to put some heat shields one the headers and thing to vent out the engine bay. Seems like fall is here now so it'll have to wait til next summer to test high temps.

I wasnt as impressed with the quality of dewitts this time around. One threaded bung had a weld bead in/on it (i had to run a tap through to clean threads) and the threads still had metal in it that wasnt cleaned out. Very sad for the cost of the product.

Also, summitt has much better pricing than the actual manufacturer. It was like pulling teeth to get the manufacturer to refund me $30.

Great looking work as usual! Very impressive!

10-15-2019 11:42 PM
7TRoadster I like the cardboard paint savers, great idea!!!
10-14-2019 08:23 PM
zimmej51
Adapters for C6 seat into C3

Here are some adapters I made to mount C6 seats in my 81 C3. Earlier I replaced the deep floor pan on the drivers side with a shallow pan. The goal was to create some space for the exhaust system.


After researching several approaches to mounting the C6 seats I decided to take a crack at making my own. I wasn't crazy about the adapter "plates" that are available, so I dug around in my shop and came up with enough raw material to make the adapters. The long plate is 1/8" steel, the spacer blocks are 3/16" steel, and the "wedge" at the rear of the plates is cut from 3/4" steel square tubing.


I ditched the motorized seat adjusters from the C6 seats. Now they have fore and aft manual adjusters, the seat back recliner lever still works and so does the seat back release behind the headrest. Height is an issue with these and I wanted to keep the seat height as low as possible. I think this is about the lowest they can be mounted without serious modification of the seat frame itself.



The pictures should be self explanatory. The adapters have a couple of holes that weren't used due to me not noticing that the seat track pedestals (at the front) are not mirror images of each other. Just had to relocate the mounting hole to clear the pedestal. Maybe this will give you some ideas if you are contemplating a swap like this.


Here are the finished adapter plates:






























Next stop for the seats is the upholstery shop for some custom covers. BTW does anybody need the seat motor tracks for a C6?
09-30-2019 10:06 PM
zimmej51
Radiator for LSx swap into 81 C3

I have a question that I could use a hand with. Pretty soon I'm going to have to pre-fit a radiator before final assembly. I was planning on using a Dewitt P/N 6139077M . That is a natural finish (aluminum) and manual transmission item.


I've been told that an OEM radiator/fan assembly from a 1998 - 2002 F body will fit with little or no modification. There is a very significant price difference between the two.



Can anyone out there confirm the fit of the F-body radiator into the late model C3?
09-28-2019 08:45 PM
zimmej51
Assembly begins

Ok, all cut, buffed and unwrapped... Let the assembly begin!











09-28-2019 08:39 PM
zimmej51
Homegrown spray booth air supply

Quote:
Originally Posted by slofut View Post
Wow ZimmeJ, That looks awesome! Really nice shop, where is the overspray going?

Hi Slofut, I'll post up the air handling system I use in my "all in one" shop. Right off the bat it goes without saying that this is just a system I have come up with based on my experiences over more years than I care to think about! Also, a setup like this is not suitable for frequent or production use. It works fine for us hobbyist types that don't have a ton of money for a real spray booth and don't paint cars very often. Probably breaks all kinds of EPA laws too!



And yes, I use squirrel cage fans because they move huge quantities of air with a relatively small size. They are not ideal for the exhaust because the blades will get a buildup eventually even with purpose made spray booth filters. I'm also aware that it is not recommended to pass the exhaust fumes over an electric motor. The preferred method is to use a belt drive fan with the motor outside of the exhaust. I have a lot of experience calibrating and using LEL (Lower Explosive Limit) instruments and I can tell you with certainty that the exhaust air stream doesn't even register on the meter. I have measured it.


Again, as hobbyists, we just don't spray enough continuously for this to be a problem. Nevertheless, attempt this at your own risk if you want to try it. So there's the obligatory cautions!



I learned years ago that it is important to keep a good airflow, or "air curtain", moving over the car while painting. This will greatly reduce particle "fallout" landing on the wet paint. The air flow simply blows them away. So the next logical step was to filter the air blowing over the car. I knocked out this air supply unit in just a few hours. I used 7/16" OSB and ripped up several 1 x 4's to 2" width. I used these for the glued on cleats. That way the box can be disassembled if I decide to keep it. The fan came from a friend in the HVAC business. They are always throwing them away. This one has a 3/4 hp motor and moves about 1500 cfm. I got a 4 x 8 sheet of plywood and cut a piece that would fight snugly inside the door frame of my shop. Then I cut a hole in the plywood that the box would fit into. To use it I just open the door, put the plywood in the door frame, roll the air box plenum up to and through the plywood. The filter size is 20" x 30". Here's what it looks like:









Next, on the inside I connected two 8" flexible ducts to the two adjustable 8" ducts on top of the air box. (Note: In this pic the air box is not in position in the plywood "door".)




The other end of the hoses connect to a "header" with two adjustable 8" ducts. The header is just hanging on my ladder.





That's the fresh air system. Next is the exhaust fan. It needs to have a bigger fan with higher capacity than the fresh air fan. I found an almost new 1 hp 2600 cfm fan online for $35. Then I built a box around it that is open on 3 sides. The 4th side has a plenum that sticks out at the bottom of my shop overhead door. It is important that the exhaust fan moves much more than the fresh air fan. The openings on the exhaust fan box are 20" x 30". I have them covered with commercial spray booth exhaust filter material.








This setup works very well. I still get a few trash "nits" in the paint but nowhere near what I get painting with no fans at all.



Another easy to make and very effective device is the light pole in this pic. I found the LED lights at Home Depot. They are very bright and come in sets of 2 lights. They come with mounting brackets, interconnect cords and power cords. The pole is nothing more than the 2" x 3/4" strips of 1 x 4's. Drilled a hole through them so that the top pole can be angled. The bottom pole is anchored by the white plastic bucket that is about half full of concrete mix. I just mixed up the concrete, stuck the lower pole in it and waited for the concrete to set up. They aren't hard to move and are very hard to tip over. Carefully placed artificial light is the key to applying just the right amount of spray. You have to be able to see the reflection of what you spray or you will most likely have dryspray or a run.



09-28-2019 01:18 PM
slofut Wow ZimmeJ, That looks awesome! Really nice shop, where is the overspray going?
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