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Old 02-02-2018, 10:50 AM   #16
Slow & Leaky
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A lot of talk here about electric fans without the essential information.

Using an electric fan with our original SI style alternators is a waste of time. Yes, they can be modded to put out 120 amps however that's going down the road, not idling. The newer CS 130/144 alternators solve the idle amp problem.

Electric fans will outperform mechanical fans at idle. All day, every day. No comparison. Because overheating is 90% about idle time.

Any electric fan big enough to support V8 cooling is going to draw more amps than a SI alternator can provide at idle. And when idle volts drag down to 11, those fans are going to cut airflow in half compared to 13.5V. Instant overheating and instant exhaust fumes from low spark voltage. Basic OHMs law stuff, decrease the voltage increase the amperage and heat and low performance result.

However, if a CS 130/144 alternator (or newer) is fitted, voltage/amperage problem solved. It's no coincidence that even junk front wheel drive cars from the 90s used CS style alternators along with their electric fans.

Been doing the modified V8/ electric fan thing since the 80s. These are facts.

Good luck with your slow N leaky vette!
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Old 02-02-2018, 12:30 PM   #17
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Grumpy has great info.
Its the manufacturers that do not give enough data.
BTU's heat rejection rate.
Best that can be done is share info and personal experiences.
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Old 02-02-2018, 12:32 PM   #18
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Even better is Horsepower cooling capacity.
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Old 02-03-2018, 07:19 AM   #19
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I would stay away with fans that are rivited as one of my friends had a blade come off and do damage. I have tried electric and not successful. Not enough air flowing over the engine when playing around. OK for rad but not enough air flow on rest of engine.
I have a plastic flex fan
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/mar-mfa118
I have run it on two engines in my vet and have had no complaints. Currently running a 383 stroker with aluminum heads close to 500 hp. Good luck
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1976 Orange Flame/Black,4sp,PS,PB,Tilt/Tel,PW,Totally Rebuilt drivetrain, 383 stroker engine from GM/750 Holley with trick kit,Elderbrock dual plane intake,Stainless steel brakes, Fiberglass leaf, Bilsteen Shocks, BFG T/A 275/60 R15 rear/BFG T/A 255 60R15 Front,Glassed over headlights. Hurst Comp shifter,Crane Hi6 ignition.
Old 02-03-2018, 01:34 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slow & Leaky View Post
Electric fans will outperform mechanical fans at idle. All day, every day. No comparison. Because overheating is 90% about idle time.

i beg to differ. every electrical fan i have tried--
sho taurus, lincoln mkViii, viper, black magic, etc...
has overheated within 15 minutes at idle. coolant everywhere,
temps 220+and climbing.

the flx-417 idled for 2.5 hours in bumper to bumper
traffic on a 90+degree, 80% humidity day without
spilling a single drop of coolant and the temp gauge
never went over 205.

and no i didnt change anything else--hoses, radiator, waterpump,etc were all same.

this isnt my opinion, its real world experience. maybe just
on my particular combo, but thats what it was.

and YES i did have the correct alternator as well as
70amp relays wired with 10G wire.
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Old 02-03-2018, 02:28 PM   #21
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The C3 is challanging to keep cool.
Come the C4 gen the Fiberglass air box that held the radiator was a nice improvement.
Bottom scooped air from under the front bumper.

If you let a Flex A Lite 398 Syclone run continous with key on all the time it helps alot.
At least for me.
They are quiet also.
Much quieter than Any OEM electric fan.
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Old 02-03-2018, 02:36 PM   #22
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I read on a Mopar Forum with the 426 Hemi guys street driving that it takes 10,000 cfm airflow to cool 1,000 Hp proper in the summer hot heat.
So It takes 5,000 cfm airflow through the radiator to cool 500 Hp.
Apparently the Mechanical Fan is superior in most cases in a C3 Zinc.
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Old 02-03-2018, 07:43 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maniacmechanic1 View Post
I read on a Mopar Forum with the 426 Hemi guys street driving that it takes 10,000 cfm airflow to cool 1,000 Hp proper in the summer hot heat.
So It takes 5,000 cfm airflow through the radiator to cool 500 Hp.
Apparently the Mechanical Fan is superior in most cases in a C3 Zinc.


yeah, all the guys who tell you how their 'lectric
fans pull 4500cfm are just trying to sell you what
they have. best i seen is the 2 spd lincoln/taurus sho
at around 3600 full out... and as i said for daily driver
reliability at around the 500hp mark, that just dont cut it.

real world testing has taught me to run mechanical fans,
mechanical fule pumps, hydraulic cams, sane 2500-2800
stall converters, 3.23- 3.73 gears, etc...

yes i could EASILY make my vette way way faster--think
tunnelram, twin 750's, 3800 stall, 4.56 gear, etc-- but
then it wouldnt be anywhere near as reliable OR as driveable.

its just what works for ME--i did all the 'mores law' cars
(you know, if some is good more must be better?) when
i was younger. nowdays i like to drive my hotrods , not
constantly work on them. and they are stll plenty fast
enough for the average 'hotrodder' who thinks they got
a quick street car.
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Old 02-03-2018, 07:54 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fatguyzinc View Post
yeah, all the guys who tell you how their 'lectric
fans pull 4500cfm are just trying to sell you what
they have. best i seen is the 2 spd lincoln/taurus sho
at around 3600 full out... and as i said for daily driver
reliability at around the 500hp mark, that just dont cut it.

real world testing has taught me to run mechanical fans,
mechanical fule pumps, hydraulic cams, sane 2500-2800
stall converters, 3.23- 3.73 gears, etc...

yes i could EASILY make my vette way way faster--think
tunnelram, twin 750's, 3800 stall, 4.56 gear, etc-- but
then it wouldnt be anywhere near as reliable OR as driveable.

its just what works for ME--i did all the 'mores law' cars
(you know, if some is good more must be better?) when
i was younger. nowdays i like to drive my hotrods , not
constantly work on them. and they are stll plenty fast
enough for the average 'hotrodder' who thinks they got
a quick street car.
Its really Hard to build a Fast & 100 % Reliable Street Car.
A Good test is start the car and warm it up.
Do a High speed run to 100-160 mph.
Bring it back.
Then Let it run for 1 hour without shutting it down.
Leave the Hood closed.
Will it overheat or not ?
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Old 02-03-2018, 07:55 PM   #25
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Many cars would fail that test Zinc.
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Old 02-05-2018, 11:20 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fatguyzinc View Post
i beg to differ. every electrical fan i have tried--
sho taurus, lincoln mkViii, viper, black magic, etc...
has overheated within 15 minutes at idle. coolant everywhere,
temps 220+and climbing.

the flx-417 idled for 2.5 hours in bumper to bumper
traffic on a 90+degree, 80% humidity day without
spilling a single drop of coolant and the temp gauge
never went over 205.

and no i didnt change anything else--hoses, radiator, waterpump,etc were all same.

this isnt my opinion, its real world experience. maybe just
on my particular combo, but thats what it was.

and YES i did have the correct alternator as well as
70amp relays wired with 10G wire.

The only car I ever met that didn't respond to an electric fan with correct input voltage had an old high density copper/brass core that was fitted in the 80s, and also had an AC condenser up front. That car struggled to stay cool even with a mechanical fan, and swapping to a standard core was eventually the solution. I notice very few brass radiator companies do the high fin count thing anymore, and there's probably a good reason why.


And about one other data point......those black magic fans are TERRIBLE. I have also been suckered into buying one. They're rated somewhere around 1700cfm but that has to be with 700 cfm of headwind. Total garbage that has been in the summit catalog for 30 years.
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Old 02-05-2018, 12:01 PM   #27
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Its all open for debate yet.
Best way to prove it is to make Videos.
Yourselves Driving at High Speeds.
Racing on the Streets.
Real easy to do .
Just use your Smart Cellphone.
Post here on Digital Corvette.
All combos can be analyzed.
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Old 02-06-2018, 10:06 AM   #28
fatguyzinc
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maniacmechanic1 View Post
Its all open for debate yet.
Best way to prove it is to make Videos.
Yourselves Driving at High Speeds.
Racing on the Streets.
Real easy to do .
Just use your Smart Cellphone.
Post here on Digital Corvette.
All combos can be analyzed.


hah hah, unbelivable---
im even more of a dinosaur than you !

i have a kyocera flip phone. it only makes calls and texts
and amazingly takes pictures but no video and no internet
connections, no games, etc...

as said every combo is different, what works for dude "A"
may not work for dude"B"s combo.

i was just saying *I* have never found an electric fan that
will reliably cool a daily driver C3 with a 500+hp 454...and
theres $1000+ worth of them sitting around on shelfs and
in closets in the garage that were tried and didnt cut it.

but i DO have a regular brass/copper 4 core 'desert cooler'
replacement radiator. maybe with an aluminum one i could
get away with an electric fan or two.
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Old 02-06-2018, 11:11 AM   #29
Maniacmechanic1
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They are only $30 bucks now from Wally World Zinc.
Its much easier posting on DC during all times of the day with a simple smart phone.
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Old 02-06-2018, 02:05 PM   #30
fatguyzinc
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maniacmechanic1 View Post
They are only $30 bucks now from Wally World Zinc.
Its much easier posting on DC during all times of the day with a simple smart phone.


at least at this point, im smarter than my phone is.
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