11/13/19 Follow up: Why did the Motor Trend Dyno of C8 go so wrong?
Two Big Mistakes:
1) The MT dyno operator selected "All-wheel Drive" and the Dyno didn't 'sense' that the front roller was not turning. So the total HP generated at the rear wheels was calculated as if it came from all wheels and THAT was THE biggest impact on the bogus results.
2) The Dyno was done on the last day that MT had the car - it had to be returned at the end of the day. Another input required by the Dyno is "Road Load HP at a certain speed." MT used a completely wrong number of 12.6HP at 50 MPH. The C8 actually 15.4HP at 50MPH.
As we reported in the past, GM has an independent Member of the SAE - certified of course - run tests to Certify the final HP of their engines and they stand by the originally realeased HP and tq numbers.
11/11/19 Automobile Writer Praises C8 and Interior in Particular
11/09/19 The Front Lift Feature uses Brake Parts
Other cars have added a front lift feature to get over speed bumps and out of angular driveways but the C8 takes a new approach. There is an aluminum block in the middle of the front crossmember that looks like an ABS module, but it's not used for the brakes in this application. The motor inside the module is a common piece used in many ABS units in other cars. Here, it directs hydrollic fluid to the front lift system that, as you know is - an industry first - tied into the GPS system enabling the driver to set/remember as many as 1,000 locations assuring the car will lift itself as it approaches the coordinates and then lower again. It is a closed system using DOT 4 standard fluid and needs no maintenance so it should never need to be opened. Option cost: $1,495
11/08/19 More on the LT2 from GM
Road and Track uncovered some more details about the LT2.
1) The LT2 uses some lighter materials and less oil for the drysump, but because the new oil reservoir is mounted to the engine it weighs the same as the LT1.
2) With more height available out back versus the need to see over the engine in front, the LT2 Manifold is 3 liters larger than the LT1.
3) The LT1 intake runners were smaller on two cylinders due to engine-mounted fuel pumps. The LT2 has equal-length runners on all cylinders. #2 & #3 result in a 3% increase in peak power and better torque on the same engine.
4) The Cats are closer to the end of the exhaust tips allowing an increase exhaust valve lift by 1mm and duration by 18 degrees, for more exhaust flow.
5) The valvetrain architecture is the same as every other small block, and the cylinder heads are shared with all GM 6.2-liter V-8s.
6) GM's assistant chief engineer for small blocks said that smaller V8s with turbochargers lose their MPG advantage due to the fact that "exhaust valves get really hot, and as a result, you end up having to go richer than [stoichiometric] to protect components, With a large displacement V-8, we don't have to do that. So, with every gram of air flow, we're adding just enough fuel to burn that amount of airflow. We don't have to go rich."
GM refused to comment when asked if that meant there would be no Turbocharged engines in Corvette's future. Mmmm.
11/6/19 C8 It's Official....
GM has confirmed that C8 production will not start until February.
11/03/19 C8 "production," vin numbers and categories
WHEN and where was/will Vin #1 be built? There are currently two 2020 Corvette VIN #00001 Stingrays with at least a third one on the way. Whaaat? Yeah. Confusing. We'll try to untangle it here if you have the patience.
C8 Manufacturing Validation Builds (MBV) have been on the streets for a long time. The first of the MBV wore Experimental VINs ending with "EX" as the final two digits. So there was a hand assembled VIN # …50001EX
. Although the earliest of these EX cars were hand assembled in Detroit, the bulk of the EX cars were built on extremely slow builds at Bowling Green. The EX cars with the 11th digit showing a "5" indicates a BG build. Digits 12 through 17 indicate production sequence. EX cars can not be legally operated on public roads EXCEPT as experimental cars. At the end of the experimental use they are destroyed or placed into a museum or permanent storage in the GM historical section (less than 5 will survive for history). The EX cars include all of the Cammoed cars, the reveal cars and the cars being shown at dealerships - approximately 100 cars. All to be destroyed.
At the National Corvette Museum’s August 25th Anniversary Celebration Plant Manager Kai Spande said, “We’re using the same line. We produce both cars[2020 C8 & 2019 C7s], most days. We’re in full production of C7 and we interject the new cars into the line.”
The first BG EX car was sent down the line without no other car on the entire assy line and with more employees involved in the assembly (an honor for them = more bragging rights) through the entire build. The body panels of this C8 were pre-covered with camo (black underneath). Tadge started the car on the line with Kai Spande in the passenger seat, and drove the car off the line.
The first hand-built C8 EX required about 11,700 manhours and the first line-built C8 was built in the fall of 2018 and taking 750 manhours. By the end of August 2019, the line-built cars were down to 189 manhours.
The next step after the EX cars, are the Captured Test Fleet (CTF) cars. These are pre-production cars that use standard Vin# and when their GM use cycle is completed, they can be sold to the public. IF the C8 follows the C7 precedent, they will produce 500 CTF units. Approximately 60 were built prior to the strike. Some of the 500 will go to Spring Mountain Resort for the Dealer Training program and the rest will likely offered to GM execs. Some might be offered to the NCM Motorsports Park.
Per Kai Spande CTF VIN 5000001
was built just a few weeks before the 25th Anniversary Celebration. HOWEVER, this CTF care is NOT the VIN #0001 that will be auctioned off at Barrett Jackson in January 2020.
Now that the strike is over, the side by side production of C8s and final C7s will resume. After the final C7 is produced (pre-sold by Barrett-Jackson last June), BG will close for 3 weeks to remove the last of the C7 tooling from the line. CTF production will then resume, slowly ramping up to full production capability and speed.
At some point the final CTF will be finished and...now it gets MORE confusing. The C7 in 2014 had 3 production "...00001" VINs. Yeah, really. The production Corvette Stingrays were assigned VIN 5100000, Premier Edition Coupes were assigned VIN 5300000, and Premier Edition Convertibles were assigned VIN 5400000 series numbers. Ugh.
After the last CTF is produced the Start Of Regular Production (SORP) starts. Sources say that the first SORP will carry VIN # 5100001
- the VIN #0001 that will be auctioned off at Barrett Jackson in January 2020.. After that will they follow the confusing 2014 C7 pattern? Do you really care?
There you have it, at least three 0001 C8 VINs....maybe 5.
The pic of the vin# below shows a suffix "EX" identifying it as a C8 Experimental model:
10/29/19 Unique DCT Fluid for the C8
Techy stuff today:
The C8 M1L eight-speed dual-clutch Transmission factory-recommended fluid utilizes ACDelco Dual-Clutch Transmission (DCT) Fluid-FFL-4 (part number 10-4130 / 19418016) which provides "friction stability at different temperatures and extended intervals." The M1L has a transmission cleanliness level that exceeds industry standards, which is critical to the dual-clutch
This fluid was selected using an extended version of the ASTM 130 Copper Corrosion test to insure optimized gear wear.
10/28/19 The C8 is faster 0-60 than the 2020 GT500 Mustang
You KNOW it hurt when 'Ford Authority' had to report that the new $74,000 760 HP top dog Mustang takes 3.5 seconds 0-60 compared to the $69,995 495 HP C8. Despite the 4000 lb GT500 weight, it boasts a 5.56 lb/HP vs the C8's 7.23 lb/HP. One is temped to say, "This is what the MIDENGINE change is all about" and one would be [90-95%] correct. Don't forget that magically consistent DCT must be good for about a quarter of a second or so.
10/26/19 UAW Strike Appears to be Over
Nothing much specific about BG yet. Here's the link:
10/24/19 MT Dyno number debunked
Well, that didn't take long. If you take the time to watch the video below, it will explain why the MT Dyno Bottom line is:
1) MT's Dyno operative made a mistake of some kind. Most likely it was in the set up of the Dyno for the C8. The video tells us that one car can provide completely different numbers depending upon the way the setup is entered.
2) Using a program that includes the input of a lot of data about a car [Aero drag, HP, weight, gear ratios, tire size, ect.] you get a reasonably accurate estimated set of performance results. Using the MT HP and Tq numbers, the C8 should deliver a 10.3 second, 134 MPH quarter mile, not the 11.1/ 124 that has been confirmed by multiple runs by different magazines.
3) Brake Mean Effective Pressure (BMEP). The pressure of torque per unit of displacement. Life is great when you learn something new. This is a torque calculation similar to HP per liter, but more accurate for torque than simple division...or I misunderstood which is possible. The important take away is that engine geeks know about and have used this calculation for a long time but most magazines haven't touched on it.
The video shows the BMEP for various NORMALLY ASPIRATED engines with 4, 6, 8, & 12 cyl and widely varied displacement from Toyota to Ferrari plus the C8 (using the GM torque rating of 470, not any of the VERY high MT Tq numbers). All have of these engines have a BMEP result between 12.0 and 13.9 which we are told is normal for an NA engine. Turbocharged engines deliver much higer BMEP numbers. They reference an AMG MB TT 4L V8 that has a BMEP of 20.5. Using the MT reported numbers applied to the LT2 specs, the BMEP would be 17.7 which is simply not possible, we are told for this engine.
There is a complete official response from GM regarding the MT dyno test that essentially says, "We stand by our published LT2 power and torque numbers."
Bottom Line: MT does a very good and honest job of evaluating and testing vehicles. But in this particular case (probably) one guy made a mistake on a complicated Dynameter and the MT reputation will take a hit. Too bad.
Vid Link - recommended; professional and educational:
10/21/19 MT Dynos the #10 Production C8; It's a head scratcher
Traditionally, when dynoing front engine, rear drive cars, we assume a 15% loss of power from the engine output to the tires turning the dyno. This loss is due to the parts drag, like differential, drive shaft, transmission and even accessories hung onto the engine (A/C, power steering, etc.). HOWEVER, MT found the LT2 FULL THROTTLE pulls pretty consistently produced upwards of 550HP and 515 lb-ft BEFORE applying the 15% assumption (this would be around 660 HP / 615lb-ft at the crank - like you see on PowerNation TV when the engine is in the booth).
MT spoke with the GM engineers and found out that GM pays for an independent SAE engineer to be present and to RATE the HP and tq of all of their engines. GM also said that the DCT is more efficient than the traditional "15% loss drive train." OK that last part makes a lot of sense, but how can the numbers be HIGHER before applying any drive train loss %? GM said the SAE engineers do NOT do full throttle pulls. They level off at various RPM points up the curve and include those results in the rating. This makes the engine much hotter along the way and at the higher RPMs. The MT engineer said this does make sense, but still would not intuitively explain the large power difference in his opinion. MT did NOT TRY to duplicate the SAE engineer's test. MT did commit to including dyno tests on future production C8s to determine if this is an anomaly, or if future C8s are consistent with this car. So, did GM drop a ringer off at all of the Car Rags for testing or is this just the result of a change in the way SAE rates engines, or ...something else?
If someone at GM provided a "ringer" engined C8 for the tests, it will take about a week after the production cars start delivery to reveal the fraud - MT or no MT involvement. This article being the catalyst for immediate testing. Obviously, a ringer engine would be VERY damaging to the reputation of the C8 AND GM AND heads would roll. ALSO, let's not forget the C8's on board Performance Data Recorder that can provide pure performance metrics such as 0-to-60-mph acceleration, quarter-mile speed and elapsed time, and even 0-100-0-mph runs. The best way for GM to put this potential issue to bed is for Tadge to make a statement something like, "If your C8 Z51 will not deliver a sub 3 second 0-60 in dry weather, take it back to your dealer for analysis." GM made a similar statement about the C6 'guarantee' to hit a top speed of 186MPH.
Bottom line; Lies about Production HP cannot stay hidden very long and the days of providing ringers to car magazines are decades in the past. The last one I recall was the first DOHC Mustangs that cheated by OVERSTATING HP. The most publically accepted understatements of power were the original all Aluminum ZL-1 big blocks and the L-88 big blocks that were under rated for insurance purposes - all three of these were LONG before SAE engineers were involved in rating power. Draw you own conclusions.
Here is the full MT article:
10/19/19 How do I find out where the C8 Tour dealer is now?
One of our members voiced his desire to go see the C8 on tour. We've not posted a schedule of the tours because Chevrolet has not posted a schedule. I saw and sat in the C8 in Costa Mesa, Ca. back on August 2. I hope each of you has the chance to see it in person soon, if you have not already.
Here is Car & Driver's suggestion:
10/18/19 A short list of some of the cars that the C8 Z51 in figure 8 time
Chevrolet is not publishing an official schedule for the C8 tour, claiming that since dealer locations are being added daily, the easiest way for people to find out when and where the tour will be close is by calling the Corvette Concierge line at 866–424–3892.
We had a good feeling the 2020 Chevrolet C8 Corvette's move to a mid-engine layout would improve performance, but somehow we didn't think the results would be so dramatic. Our 3LT trim tester equipped with the Z51 package lapped our figure eight course in 23.3 seconds, a MotorTrend test that evaluates cornering, acceleration, braking, and the transitions in between.
Most of these originally sold for multiple times the C8 price.
1) 2011 Porsche 911 GT3 RS
2) 2016 Mercedes-AMG GT S - 2015 Best Driver's Car winner
3) 2013 Dodge SRT Viper - 640 HP
4) 2019 Jaguar XE SV Project 8 - 592 HP fastest four-door car around the Nürburgring
5) 2006 Saleen S7 Twin Turbo - 750 HP mid engine.
6) 2010 Corvette ZR1 - 638 HP
7) 2017 Audi R8 V10 Plus - 610 HP mid engine
8) 2019 Aston Martin DBS - 715 HP TT V12
9) 2010 Ferrari 458 Italia - 570 HP
10) 2012 Lexus LFA - 552HP V10 2011 Best Driver's Car winner
10/17/19 Supposed Leaks of Future Power and Models
The C8 also tied a 2018 Porsche 911 Carrera T's figure-eight time, though at higher average g-forces.
THIS IS UNCONFIRMED AT THIS TIME:
Two separate sources are posting the following C8 future:
1) Z06 will be a normally aspirated 600 HP flat plane DOHC 5.5 L V8 with a redline of ~8600 RPM.
2) ZR1 will sart with the Z06 engine and add twin turbos and apparently a ton of boost to develop 850 HP with a slightly lower redline.
3) Zora or iRay (it will be Zora IMO) will add 250 HP electric motor and batteries where the Frunk is enabling short period blasts of 1,000 HP. This model will have a LOT more dynamic suspension and aero bits included so expect BIG $$ for this one.
Again, these are UNCONFIRMED, but they do make a lot of sense. A non-turbo for the Z06 would eliminate any controversy about the FIA LM GTE 300 production units requirement and remove some of the potential C7-type reliability issues. Before anyone starts whining about the Z06 HP reduction, please keep in mind that the 495 HP Z51 beats the C7 Z06 to 60MPH, so a 9000 RPM 600 HP C8 Z06 should bury most of the C7 ZR1 performance numbers. The insurance premiums for the C8 ZR1 and Zora will probably resemble my house payment and owners should invest in a local tire store.
10/16/19 Motor Trend Wastes no time; 911 CarreraS vs C8 Z51 Comparo
PLEASE NOTE: MT clarified that THIS test subject was PRODUCTION CAR Vin # 10. As previously reported here, tests of hand assembled C8s would be meaningless AND BG is, obviously now, capable of building C8s and C7s at the same time. Although an early build, the following IS a Production C8.
The C8 (209 lbs heavier, 4" longer, 3" wider and 2" lower) delivered 2.8 second 0-60 is .1 second quicker than the CarreraS and that carries through to the C8's .1 second quicker Quarter mile time of 11.1 @ 123.2MPH. The 495HP from the C8 comes on quickly and smoothly all the way up the band. The Vette power to weight is 7.3 lbs per 1 HP and the CarreraS is 7.7. The lesser power & tq Porsche gets kicked when the twin turbos come on making it feel more "urgent" but MT liked the excitement feeling. The C8 "...cabin is so isolated that you never like you're going as fast as you are. It just goes."
The CarreraS wins circle driving with a skid pad of 1.09G vs the C8 1.08G and it wins the figure 8 by .6sec an .04G. The driver noted that the C8 was not the "unpredictable mess" the C7 Z51 was in the Figure 8 but, "...this new car communicative, responsive, and easy to drive." MT pointed out that, "The figure eight is not the real world, though. It's not even a racetrack."
MT could not get a race track so they used a closed road to "track" the two cars with the 911 .6 seconds faster.
"Many sports car makers have tried to match Porsche's class-defining PDK dual-clutch gearbox. Precious few have come close. But the Corvette does—on the first try, no less. During our figure-eight testing, Reynolds, who almost always shifts manually in this drill, found the 'Vette's dual-clutch good enough to not bother. If you prefer to pull the paddles, you'll find the Corvette immediately responsive and happy to let you pull a downshift that drops you just under redline. It'll let you sit there, too, and stall at the fuel cutoff rather than shift for you."
"The Corvette's fourth-generation magnetic dampers are the stuff of magic, keeping the car just as planted and confident in the corners as the 911 while providing huge advantages in ride quality."
"...in its default Tour driving mode, the Corvette rides like a luxury sport sedan while still handling like a mid-engine sports car. Crank it up to Sport mode, and you're roughly where the 911's default ride quality resides, with more vertical motion and louder impacts passed into the cabin. Go all the way to Track mode, and it's pretty stiff, but even then it's never harsh. Even the worst craters in the road are heard in the massive tires more than they're felt in your spine. The Porsche may be a little quicker around a track, but there's no question which car you'd rather drive home..."
"The Corvette allows far less engine and road noise into the cabin than the 911. There's more noise from those big tires, especially the front ones right next to your feet, but you can have a whispered conversation at 80 mph in the Corvette. You'll have to speak up a little in the Porsche. It's just one of the ways in which the Corvette's cabin is nicer than the 911's, a sentence we feared we'd never get to write."
"Corvette's controls more intuitively laid out—even that long strip of Chiclet buttons down the center console"
"Corvette's infotainment system is less cluttered and layered, and it's easier to read at a glance and operate while the car is in motion."
"Corvette's highly customizable digital dash and the bits of theater provided by the transitions between screens won many points over the 911's pair of screens"
"Corvette's squircle steering wheel might take a little getting used to, but it affords a clear view of all the information on the instrument cluster."
"The Corvette's geo-tagged nose lift feature is a must-have and works perfectly to save the chin spoiler."
"...any direction but forward, the 911 is simply easier to see out of."
"It's always been easy to write off the Corvette as producing big numbers with all the grace of 12-pound sledge. No more. If you're willing to give up a little bit of steering feel and learn to work around the brake pedal, you'll find far more car to love in the Corvette. Performance per dollar used to be an excuse to brush away the Corvette's shortcomings. Now, it's a virtue. Exotic and attainable, it finally punches above its weight class in every category, not just one. When it's this damn good, money matters. The Corvette isn't good enough for the price. It's unbeatable."
The 911 Carrara S was pretty bare. The as tested price did NOT include power seats. Yeah.
Comparo Winner : 2020 Corvette C8
.......................................C 8 vs 911 CarreraS
"BASE PRICE .........…….$69,945...….$114,650
PRICE AS TESTED........$88,305.......$122,640"
10/15/19 SURPRISE C&D Published their test TODAY!
Someone at Car & Driver looked at their calendar wrong. Today is NOT Wednesday but they published their Review today. 0-60 in 2.8 seconds (Z-51, MR Suspension). 1.1 seconds faster than the manual trans C7 Z51. However, the C8 weight gain added 10 ft to the 70-0 stop at 149ft. C&D's biggest complaint: It's a bit too refined in Tour mode around town where it rides like a sedan and it's not as loud and steering is not as twtichy fast as a 911 (seems like the remedy to that is one notch up the 6 driving modes?). The Quarter is gone in 11.2 @ 122 MPH (C7 Z51 = 11.7 @ 119).
C&D had this car for a week and ran it at Gattan Raceway against a C7 Z51..."the C8 turned a best lap of 1:26.1, the C7 a 1:27.0. A roughly one-second difference might not sound like much, but consider that after just a half-dozen laps, the C8 would cross the finish line as the C7 pulls onto Grattan’s straight. ...the C8 braked later into several corners and accelerated harder." The C8 pull more Gs in every curve and corner - as we would expect. "But such close lap times don’t remotely convey how much easier it is to go fast in the C8. It cuts more cleanly into turns, and its rear tires are more planted exiting them; the C7’s tail is nervous and twitchy by comparison."
The faster you go, the better the C8 feels. The steering cuts like a race car's, and the cornering limits are virtually out of reach on the street....For a base car with the Z51 package and FE4 dampers, you're looking at only $66,890. This is nothing less than the democratization of the exotic car.....Extensive acoustic insulation has made the C8 not only quieter by three decibels at 70 mph than the C7, but just plain quiet. This kind of dynamic bandwidth is almost unheard of in the mid-engine exotic realm.....Overall, this is by far the best Corvette interior ever.....After all that poking and prodding, we have concluded that the new C8 is spectacular, amazing, and supremely capable. Maybe even revolutionary.
10/14/19 We will see Car Rag First Drive Reviews Wednesday
Motor Trend and Car & Driver (at least) will publish public road tests and (at least) a C7 Z51 vs. C8 Z51 side by side track test at Grattan Raceway's road-racing circuit (C&D). Both magazines got air with their C8s. Both have agreed that they cannot publish any specifics until Wednesday. Motor Trend ran on a closed Ca road. The jump was made in "Tour" mode. Upon returning the Red C8 to GM, MT told them about the jump. GM's response, "Only Tour mode? Why not "Sport" and "Track" modes too?" Here is a quote from the MT jump:
10/13/19 The C8 Makes its First Ever Petit Le Mans Appearance
The whole thing was surprisingly mundane," Trajano said. "All I could hear was tire noise in the run up to the jump. The jump itself was almost serene because of the momentary break in between tires touching the road. Landing was smooth as butter, like it was made for that jump. Could've used more speed for sure." Photographers always say that.
Long time Corvette Racing driver Tommy Milner piloted a new Chevrolet Corvette C8.R (#4) for a couple of "demo laps" prior to the start of the Motul Petit Le Mans at Michelin Raceway Road Atlanta.
10/10/19 Today's C8 headline: We know all about the C8.R engine
GM has confirmed that the racer WILL run a 5.5 Liter, DOHC, Flat Plane, NORMALLY Aspirated V8 with 500 HP and 480 pound-feet of torque. Yep, 10 HP more and 10 pound-feet more than the production LT2....but much higher revving. Pratt & Miller (Corvette Racing engineering) has apparently decided they prefer the combination of [more Normally Asperated Cubic Inches] versus [fewer turbo charged Cubic Inches] - the latter worked well for the Ford GT so we are surprised by this configuration considering the Le Mans more lenient rules for smaller Turbo charged engines.
As we told you in the past, GT Le Mans homologation rules require that at least 300 production version engines must be built, so this confirms that the Z06 will offer a version of this engine. BUT it need not be NA. It could have Turbos. Let's get real. We've seen them. It WILL have two outboard turbos to probably produce at 675-700HP (the C7 supercharged LT4 = 650HP). The 5.5 liter engine of the Corvette C7.R produces 491 horsepower at 6,000 RPM so like the C7 Z06, the C8 Z06 will provide considerably more HP than the race car is allowed to have under the rules.
10/09/19 Motor Trend says NEXT WEEK!
MT is saying that next week they will be publishing a comprehensive test of the C8. C&D and R&T won't be far behind. We've seen indications that R&T's testing might be a comparo. This is about to get really interesting. CAUTION! Although the cars the car rags will be testing are "Production Spec" we need to realize that they are NOT production cars to the best of our current knowledge. Looking forward to hear from the editors if the tested cars are more of the hand assembled cars we've seen at dealers or if they are pilot cars off the assembly line. I don't think they would put pilot cars into the hands of industry testers, but maybe we'll find out next week.
10/7/19 The Detroit Free Press is claiming the UAW strike is a severe hit to the Production Schedule
Contrary to some reports we have already received, the DFP claims that BG still hasn’t finished production of the C7 and after the strike is settled, they must finish that up before changing the tooling over to C8 production. Back in June Barrett-Jackson sold the last C7 Corvette that WOULD be produced for $2.7 million. I have NOT been able to find anything confirming the delivery of that purchased C7 (a Black Z06), but the final orders for SOLD C7s were terminated on 7/18/19 (C8 debut date). The UAW strike started almost 2 months after that on 9/15/19.
In the past the DFP has had a reputation of being pretty reliable. Here are some facts: Bowling Green has had the capability of producing two different Generations of Corvettes on the same assembly line since they were producing some C6's during the C5 final model year. BTW, GM's Aussie Holden factory pioneered this technic and it has spread to other selective GM plants. Regardless, if there are more C7s that MUST be produced, this would NOT STOP the conversion of much of the assembly line over to C8 production while the strike is taking place. Obviously, the total production volume would NOT be C8 for however long it takes to wrap up the C7 production. Also, GM could approach those pre-sold C7 buyers about changing their orders to C8 with some incentives - or not.
BOTTOM LINE - the biggest C8 production time delay issue is the strike itself. Once the strike is over, GM has TWO Shifts of BG workers ready to start rolling the cars out of the plant. The upside? You can bet that Tadge still has teams out there real world testing C8s looking for any possible needed tweaks to the mountain of algorithms helping you drive the C8.
10/6/19 Why should we care about the C8.R except for bragging rights if it wins?
The Le Mans race GTE class homologation rules that the Corvette C8.R must follow, state that the “engine must be derived from a series production engine produced at more than 300 units and fitted to a series vehicle from the same manufacturer.” This means that the C8.R engine will be used, or directly derived from, a Corvette C8 production engine. The Z06 is the obvious candidate for the production version of the engine.
The 100% consensus of the 'Automotive Knowledgeable' at the Vert/C8.R reveal who heard the racer revving, state without a doubt, that it is NOT an LT2 engine. The overwhelming opinion is that the quick, high revving, LOUD engine they heard reminds one of a Ferrari engine (Flat Plane, DOHC) much more than the 5.5L OHV V8 that has powered the C6.R and the C7.R. Also interesting is that no one has mentioned anything about hearing any Turbo sound at the reveal. IF THERE ARE NOT TURBOS, then the displacement MUST be 5.5 liters to be competitive. We have been told that the new DOHC engine would be based on the Cad Blackwing but always in the same sentence it is made clear it will NOT BE the Blackwing. Separately, an engineer has stated that the 4.2L Blackwing block cannot be punched out to 5.5 L. Add to that, the Blackwing has twin turbos mounted INBOARD, between the V of the V8 which makes the heads VERY UNIQUE.
We have posted the CAD drawing of the C8 DOHC V8 with outboard twin turbos in the past (again below) but we don't know if that engine will be in the Z06, ZR1 or another model (Zora?). The Blackwing heads would NOT appear to be adaptable to outboard turbos so it is extremely unclear how the Blackwing could contribute in any way at all to the C8 engine unless the CAD drawings are of an abandoned project which would beg the question; why leak a CAD of an abandoned project?
So today's educated guess/compilation of facts is that the C8 Z06 and C8.R racer (sing a shorter stroke version) will likely share engine designs of Flat Plane DOHC V8 that is surprisingly normally aspirated. If NA, the displacement MUST be 5.5L if they have any hope of winning GTE.
Cad Blackwing cutaway:
GM Leaked CAD of the Twin Turbo DOHC V8:
10/5/19 In Depth Video on Infotainment System
The C8 Tour comes to Vlogging Sales guy's dealership and he takes us through the Infotainment screen choices in the dash. It's a quick tour and he loses camera focus a couple of times but it IS informative and impressive, IMO.
10/03/19 Hear the 'Mystery' C8.R Engine
What do YOU hear? Does that just sound like last year's OHV engine to you? It certainly doesn't have the F1 high revving loud sewing machine sounds, nor that of one of their street versions like a Ferrari. Sounds a bit more cranky (pun intended). Le Mans rules are more generous for turbo engines and the hot rumors are that the Z06 will have a flat plain DOHC TT engine, a version of which could make it into the C8.R. Notice that the rear window glass has been blacked out = no view of the engine. Intriguing.
Please look BELOW the immediately following Vert data to see the reveal of the C8.R that will have its debut at Daytona in January.
10/02/19 NCM Site shows C8 Vert
- The Convertible will be priced $7,500 higher than the 1LT coupe.
- The Top stores horizontally in a compartment above the engine.
- The mid-engine 2020 Corvette Stingray was engineered first and foremost as a convertible.
- It weighs 3,637 lbs; 102 more than the Stingray; 60 more than the Z51.
- The hardtop stows seamlessly into the body, maintaining the Frunk and the trunk even with the top down.
- The nacelles help reduce air recirculation into the cabin.
- The tonneau also provides a rear power-adjustable window and a vent for mid-engine cooling.
- The two-piece top can be activated at speeds up to 30 mph and retract in as few as 16 seconds.
Powered by six electric motors and uses encoders for precise control..
- A body-colored roof is standard, while Carbon Flash metallic-painted nacelles and roof are optional.
- The sheet-molded composite top stows in a compartment made from lightweight composite panels and heat shields to manage heat from the engine.
- A divider glass window in the middle of the vehicle can be power adjusted with the top up or down.
- The glass has been optimized to reduce air recirculation and wind noise in the cabin for improved quietness.
- The same rear spoiler used on the Stingray coupe’s Z51 Performance Package, results in identical drag between the coupe and convertible with the top up.
- The chassis springs and dampers have been tuned specifically to provide nearly the same performance as the coupe.
- The drive train is the same as that in the Coupe
Short Video - includes top being raised while moving
Long Video of the Reveal at Cape Canaveral
10/02/19 The C8.R revealed
NO announcement about the engine powering the C8.R was made.
There will be two C8.R debuting at Daytona in January.
One car will wear the colors you see and the other will wear the more traditional Yellow and Black colors.
You might recall that we reported to you a month+ ago that we observed what appears to be a dynamic wing on the C8.R Prototype. Here's a closeup of it. Notice the long slot that enables the wing angle to be altered via electric motor(s?). Full forward is probably a vertical as possible for stopping.
Lots of pics of the C8.R:
10/01/19 C8 Vert Debuts Tomorrow
What do we know? Nothing new so we will have lots to post tomorrow after the reveal. To recap what we already know:
The Vert will weigh in at 3,637 lbs, 102 more than the Stingray and 60 more than the Z51.
The Folding hardtop power button is near the power window buttons on the driver's door panel.
All of the rest we know can be seen in the following pics:
9/30/19 Listen and watch as a 'passenger' as Road and Track runs a C8 around Thunderhill Raceway (Nor. Cal.)
As part of the R&T Performance Car of the Year testing, the following video was shot as a promo. Good opportunity to hear the engine and the shifts. Enjoy the sweet sounds.
Also, during the testing, they messed around a bit. Two different editors, one 5' 9" and the other 6"1' managed to fit themselves into the rear trunk (NOT at the same time). So two sets of golf clubs or one R&T Editor can fit in the trunk.
Also; The frame is STIFF. The C8 can be parked on undulating terrain so that one tire is a few inches up in the air.
09/29/2019 C8 Hybrid Prototype spotted
As you see, the Hybrids still wear cammo, but the big red plug resting on the passenger front fender is not good at keeping secrets.
Realize that the hybrid is the rumored 1,000 HP model. Notice that the edges of the fenders do not look like they have the vertical flat terminations that we have seen on the C8 Stingrays. They look 'extended' like flairs. Wide body?
09/27/19 Convertible Power Top Controls
Coupe (sorry for bad quality):
09/27/19 Praise from future Owner about GM Order Service
For those who place orders, I'm sure that service can vary from one Dealership to another, but the following was posted on Facebook from someone who is experiencing a very positive information flow"
09/25/19 No News but be assured we will post it here when it comes
I wanted to let everyone know how absolutely impressed I am with communication with Chevrolet on ordering this vehicle. They have a concierge service that is far and away one of the best I’ve ever dealt with when ordering a vehicle. I have ordered Ferraris, Lamborghinis, Aston Martins, Maseratis and Porsches and have never gotten this type of immediate response and knowledge about intricacies with the vehicle. If you have any questions I suggest reaching out to them, they can definitely answer anything. If they don’t know they send Harlan an email and he gets right back to them so they can get back to you.
One guy is claiming there will be a 4th seat option in 2021, but that's about it. Not confirmed, by the way.
09/23/2019 North American Car of the Year Finalist
The North American Car of the Year award is presented to the finest automotive product produced for a given model year, each year. There are 3 separate categories; passenger cars, utility vehicles, and trucks. The winners are usually announced at the North American International Auto Show in Detroit. The winners are selected by 50 respected jurors from print, online, radio and broadcast Automotive media across the U.S. and Canada. GM has two models vying for the award; The Corvette C8 and the Cadillac CT5. Historically the NAIAS has been held in January in Detroit but beginning in 2020, the NAIAS moves to June in Detroit. At this point in time, THAT is when the NA COTY will be announced.
09/20/19 Resource Reminder
We seem to have entered a lull in the new information 'leaks.' It might start up again as we get closer to the C8 Vert reveal. In the meantime, about 7 weeks+ ago we told you about a series of GM Engineer produced SHORT videos explaining details about the C8. Selecting the link below will take you to a You Tube index of 23 SHORT videos that are told in first person by engineers and GM personnel. Quite informative and professionally presented. Hope you can find the time to view them:
09/20/19 UNCONFIRMED RUMOR - C8 Vert
With the official GM C8 Convertible Reveal scheduled for October 3, a rumor that Convertible Production will start on February 10 is spreading across multiple sites on the internet.
Seems a bit odd. The last communication regarding C8 orders we heard was that the first phase of production (January - March or as long as May) was almost sold out. This rumor states that the Convertible, for which there are zero orders at this point, will start roughly 6 weeks into the first phase of production. Seems like we are missing some pretty key information if this rumor is true.
1) Was there always a block of the first phase of C8 production designated to be Convertibles?
2) Is BG increasing production volumes to accommodate new, expected Vert orders?
GM has repeatedly surprised us in the past so we will find out the FACTS in a few weeks.
9/19/19 Production Constraints
Below is a link to a Vlog from a Vette Sales guy providing the production constraint information as of today. Since Production is not currently taking place, these 'constraint announcements' would seam to telling us that they have built inventories for the options that are NOT ON CONSTRAINT.
09/18/2019 UAW strike impact on the C8 -updated
- GM Authority is reporting that they think the first C8 deliveries will not be impacted by the strike.
Short answer: Short Term; Yes. Bowling Green UAW workers ARE currently picketing the plant and no cars are coming off the assembly line. At a minimum, worker participation/training in the spool up of the C8 are suspended. Not only is the product (the C8) new, almost half of the workers are new to BG hired for a second shift of C8 building. Announced intentions indicate the production line will begin MUCH slower than normal to assure the highest quality is maintained.
The final C7 rolled out of the BG Plant on 7/28/19. GM poured $773Million into almost doubling the size of BG since 2017. GM announced that the Cadillac DOHC TT V8 Blackwing will be assembled at the Performance Center at BG and rumor has it that the LT2 and all of the C8 engines will also be assembled there.