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Just Another Night in The Junkman's Garage...

223K views 998 replies 61 participants last post by  Junkman2008 
#1 ·
... which is why I can never get anyone to come over at help me with my DIY's. Doesn't anyone else keep my kind of hours? :huh:

Guess what I'm doing...



 
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#82 ·
Oh man... That really sucks! Especially after JUST doing all that body and AC work! I don't think that even Patrick ever broke his block... :thud: Thought Marines were taught to adapt and overcome though? Gonna let a little thing like a broken block stop you? C'mon McGyver...I know you got a couple of zip ties, some chewing gum and bicycle chain in your garage somewhere. With all the DIYs I have seen you accomplish, you are telling me that you are not gonna rip that bitch out yourself? :D Tell me you are not gonna pack it in...that a repair is in her future. Maybe a DCC (coupe)? :laughing:

I suppose, given the extreme circumstances, we can let you bring the El Camino to Carlisle...just gonna have to park it way in the back. At least it is a Chevy also...
 
#83 ·
:laughing:

Okay Coach Ragtop!

I don't know why I'm not, but I should be totally bummed out. I am, but I am not loosing sleep over it yet. Maybe I'm still numb. Maybe I don't know it, but there is someone out there with an easy fix or ready to help out. I can't figure it out. Maybe I should just play the lottery.

I haven't given up, I'm looking for answers. I'm thinking and looking. I hope I can figure this out. The expense of pulling the motor and switching everything to a new block is scary because it could happen again in reality. I don't want a different motor but I world entertain a short block as a last resort. I've got to really think this one through. I hope it doesn't hit me later on and cause me to pass out!

I think that I will be able to trade in my shade tree mechanic's branches after this one. :thud:
 
#84 ·
Glad it came across like coaching rather than being an ass! :D

At the risk of sounding like a suck-up, I fear that this would make you sell the car and move on to other things. I can't speak for everyone here but I feel confident in saying that you are an inspiration to many of us and seeing your DIYs and other explanations (remember, I bought $500 in Adam's stuff PLUS a Porter Cable machine because of you) have given me the knowledge to take on things with this car that I might never have had the cajones to do otherwise.

Would I ever do the kind of body work you did? Doubtful. Would I consider a compressor replacement if the need arose? Maybe...

Anyway, point being, I hope that this is not the end of your postings and that if this car is not the one you keep, that you remain in the Vette family because I look forward to reading your advice and commentary. Chin up Buckaroo...LS9 Crate engines are only 21K...start saving your sheckles!
 
#85 ·
Thanks man. It's guys like you that keep me posting. I'm not getting rid of the car, even if it takes me a year to repair it. I've put way too much blood and guts into it now. Anyway, Marines never retreat, we just advance in a different direction. Damnit, I'm gonna advance until my dying breath! :thumbsup:

Now where's that damn Chereo when I need him? :huh:
 
#88 ·
WELL DOUBLE CRAP!!! :surprised

I just spent 30 minutes composing a detailed response and the forum lost my post when I hit Preview?

This makes me sick just to look at it - deja-vu. Exact same thing that happened to me 3 years ago!

By any chance had you washed the engine just before this happened. I have always blamed myself for my incident as it occurred right after I washed my engine.

The Dealership must have had at least 10 people out to look at mine when it happened. Everyone said it had to be Hydrolock. Then they pulled the shield and to everyone's surprise, the flywheel turned freely.

One mechanic said it could be rewelded and retapped, but the GM Rep said no way as the tap would have to be so precise. Therefore, they gave me a new long-block under my GMPP Extended.

To this day I still hold my breath every time I turn the key! Very helpless feeling.

My heart goes out to you man... nobody should have as many problems as you have lately (or I did year #7).

There is no reason why they had to make the LS1 block so frail in that area? I am really surprised it is not a more common problem. This is the 3rd confirmed case I have seen.

This really makes me sick - I had hoped mine was just a one in a million fluke.

(ignore my red circle in one photo - that was from an old post).






 
#86 ·
Hey Junk read up on this link..This guy had the same problem...It can be welded....One guy was saying it can be done without pulling th engine.....This what Addictedto said in the thread

Addictedto:

It CAN be welded, I have aluminum race motors that have had multiple "windows" repaired. Its one of the main reasons we use aluminum blocks. I have seen some in chassis repairs you wouldn't believe. Someone who is a VERY good TIG welder can get into some really tight spots and it can be welded overhead.



Read this

http://www.lotustalk.com/forums/f15...-failure-welding-aluminum-engine-block-74165/
 
#89 ·
WOW! Even your starter broke just like mine did! Well you can add a few more documented cases to that list. The guy above, who Crusher turned me on to (follow the link), and then Sundevil over on CF. Here's another guy with a LS1 who had the same problem over on LS1Tech, along with this guy too.

As I'm looking around the web, I'm finding this horror story every where. Here's one more guy who's starter and block did it too. These are just a few documented cases. There are a bunch more documented and no telling how many that are not documented. Man, this is ugly. I have to think that GM knows about this. There are too many instances of this happening.

By the way, I didn't wash the engine before this happened. It was early in the morning and the block was cold.
 
#99 ·
By the way, I didn't wash the engine before this happened. It was early in the morning and the block was cold.
Sure having trouble submitting posts the past few hours?

Hmmm... Now I am wondering if maybe the Starter Casing is the "weak link" and not necessarily the block itself. The way these appear to "tear-away" at the block flange through the entire length of the threaded area and yet completely "shear" the starter in the same place, it looks more to be like the Starter case may be breaking off FIRST which would obviously rotate a piece of the block off.

Maybe an aftermarket Starter with a beefed up Starter case may be the solution?
 
#90 ·
Sorry to hear about that AJ. Man you musta ran over a black cat or pissed off a witch or something with all the bad luck you've had with that car lately. Have you been "dating" any ladies from Haiti? You know they have voodoo down there right? Be carefull.

In all seriousness though, that sucks but I'm sure you'll figure it out. If I knew how to fix it for you, I'd be glad to. However I doubt a little JB Weld is gonna hold that baby on there.

I'll be up at Carlisle on Friday the 26th so if you'll be there that day I'll look you up.

:thumbsup:
 
#92 ·
Not Haiti, but one from Nigeria. Is that the same thing? :lookinup:

Man, I don't know if I could stand in the holy mecca of Corvette land knowing that my baby is broke. Carlisle is probably out for me. :(


Yeah your right Junk, too many cases happening..GM must know :lookinup:......Your right about the fix in the link I sent you..Looks like it lasted him about 11 months before it snapped again...hmmm ...Like he said a good TIG welder may do the trick...Then again the others were saying to yank the engine to do the weld properly :lookinup:...In any case it can be fixed don`t give up :thumbsup:
I'm seeing the TIG weld suggestion in quite a few places. Either way, the block has got to come out of the car in order to do this right, at least that's what I'm thinking. Don't expect a DIY on THAT adventure! :thud:
 
#91 ·
Yeah your right Junk, too many cases happening..GM must know :lookinup:......Your right about the fix in the link I sent you..Looks like it lasted him about 11 months before it snapped again...hmmm ...Like he said a good TIG welder may do the trick...Then again the others were saying to yank the engine to do the weld properly :lookinup:...In any case it can be fixed don`t give up :thumbsup:
 
#94 ·
Okay, I found the thread. Looking at the block where the outside bolt housing is you can see very little block material, or wall, around the bolt hole. It looks as though the casting had a crack there since dirt and oil got in. The other thing I noticed is the 'graininess' of the aluminum around the break. It seems excessive, but hard to determine in the picture. However if you have to go that route this may be damning to GM in that it may be a defective block...and they have that 100k mile thing going on...

Before you call it quits, you may want to try that 'fix' I PM'd you about. You'll have to be ultra careful and shield a lot of the none metal in the area, along with completely cleaning the block of any oil and grease...
 
#102 ·
Well the replacement starter that I'm going with IS a GM starter. It was only installed on the GM trucks that had LS1'a in them. Thus, GM can't complain about their own parts!

By the way, the forum speed has been questionable lately. Maybe the hosting company is working on something.
 
#109 ·
#110 · (Edited)
Well I be damned again! This time in a good way! Check this out.

If you have followed this episode thus far, Chereo and I both have come to the same conclusion as to why this failure happens. To recap, the short bolt bracket side of the starter (closest to the flywheel) breaks away from the starter, which leaves all of the stress on the long bolt (outer edge of the engine block). When you attempt to start the car, the stress on the outer edge of the block is so extreme, that it cause the block failure. The consensus to eliminating this issue is to use a starter that has a reinforced bracket, which uses 2 LONG bolts instead of the 1 long and one short bolt. It is the reinforced bracket that eliminates this failure, not the length of the bolts. The bolts are only mentioned because the reinforced starter bracket REQUIRES 2 long bolts.

So as I'm about to roll out for a network job, I glance over at my new starter sitting on the bench and suddenly have a "I don't freakin' believe it" moment. Look at what I saw:





Now here's the deal. I DID NOT ask for a GM LS1 truck starter when I bought this. I asked for a 2001 Corvette (non-Z06) starter. That's the car I have. When they bought it out, I inspected the contents of the box and saw only one bolt. At first I was going to ask the guy why it only came with one bolt, but I didn't because I was thinking that I would just reuse my old short bolt. At the time, I didn't know all about this starter issue so I didn't pay attention to what the bracket looked like, APPARENTLY, GM has acknowledged that the old design had an issue and has started selling this reinforced version as a direct replacement! How about them apples! :surprised

Another thing. The instructions in the box stated that you HAD to use the supplied bolt. I stared at that bolt and my old long bolt and I couldn't figure out why it was required. Now I know!

This starter comes with a lifetime warranty and the packaging states that it is an AC Delco brand (even though the box it comes in says differently). However, stamped on the starter itself, I see this:



That explains what the paperwork said regardless of what the box looks like:





I bought this starter from Bumper to Bumper for $112.00, minus the $60 core charge (this store is nationwide so there may be one near you). The dealer wanted almost $500.00 for the same starter. :surprised

So for you guys who are following this saga, I would be changing out your starter if you have the old design. It's not a bad job at all and if you get up under the car, you will be able to see which design you have without disassembling anything. The hardest part of the job is unplugging the connector position assurance (CPA) locks (which are fancy zip tie looking things that keep the H02 sensor plugs from vibrating apart). Most guys would just cut them and use some zip ties when they reassemble every thing but I'm a little more anal. :D

Man, I hope someone benefits from this. I don't want to see anyone else go through this headache. :thud:


AJ, sounds like time for a mild performance rebuild. I have a set of LS6 heads and a used short block I'd sell ya for a pretty good deal.
No upgrades in horsepower for me. The main reason is my 500Hp El Camino and all the headaches involved with it. That was my last souped up engine build. This Corvette is staying stock. Maybe when the motor goes for good, I'll add some better quality parts but this go cart is plenty fast for me. :thumbsup:
 
#111 ·
This is the first time I have heard of this, and I have the old style starter. I do have ARP starter bolts in the mail, makes me a little angry now. Too bad I can't afford the MSD starter currently and will have to wait until after vacation to do it. I will definately be inspecting my starter this weekend
 
#112 ·
Over on the LS1 boards, this is a little more known about. That's how I found out about it. I am surprised however, that I have never seen this on the discussed on the Corvette boards. The only thing that I have ever seen are the few post that discuss the broken bolt hole, but nothing about the starter design. Everyone that I have seen discuss this has speculated that the engine block had a bad design or there were just a bunch of bad blocks from a specific run.

I think the key will be, if you go to start the car and hear the slightest little funny sound, stop while you're ahead.

Wow. I need to put the word out! :surprised
 
#114 ·
No kidding man, this has been going on with the Camaro guys for a while. They are on it. Now we Vette guys need to get with the program. I would have so been on this upgrade if I knew before hand.

By the way, I'm showing 21 locations in your area using the 79106 zip code. Is that close to you?
 
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