C3 door gap question. - Corvette Forum : DigitalCorvettes.com Corvette Forums
 
 
Go Back   Corvette Forum : DigitalCorvettes.com Corvette Forums > C3 Corvette Forums > C3 Corvette
Register Forums Garage Garage Mark Forums Read Auto EscrowInsurance Advertise

Notices

C3 Corvette
C3 Corvette General | Technical | Performance | Aftermarket | Discussions

Other sections:
Corvettes Classifieds
Corvette Detailing & Car Care
Corvette Audio/Video/Radar
General Automotive/Shop/Tools
Corvette Performance Driving/Racing

( Sponsored by: Zip Corvette Parts )

Shops/Tuners
Custom Image Corvettes
A&A Corvette
Corvette tuner

Interior
Corvette aftermarket products

Insurance



Parts & Products
Race Ramps
Edelbrock
ATI/Procharger
Corvetteguys.com
Melrose Motorsports
Parts Taxi
Airaid
Pfadt Racing
Madvette Motorsports
Hi-tech Custom Concepts
Corvette Garage
Corvette Parts and Accessories
Corvette Car Care Products
Corvette HID

Tracks/Schools
Bob Bondurant School of High Performance Driving
Corvette driving school

Wheels/Tires
Cray Wheels

Services
BADWERKS.com
Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 12-07-2014, 07:17 PM   #1
Pops71lives
DC Crew
 
Pops71lives's Avatar
 
Posts: 726
Member #132985
Member since: Oct 2013
Location: Goshen/Indiana/USA

My Corvette(s)
1971

Thanks: 245
Thanked 106 Times in 96 Posts
C3 door gap question.

I've read through several posts and at this point I may be suffering from brain drain. I have the body back on the frame and the rear of the door is to high to close the door at the rear upper portion. Looking at the dooe it would be the top right corner. I noted the shims and replaced exactly the same as they were at removal. Any thoughts? Several hours today messing with shim placement/removal. Little frustration setting in. To complicate matters cage nut number 2 decided to start spinning on itself so I have to address that somehow.
Pops71lives is offline   Reply w/quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 12-07-2014, 08:20 PM   #2
binx
DC Crew
 
Posts: 247
Member #127929
Member since: Jul 2013
Location: Hawaii

My Corvette(s)
1973 Stingray

Thanks: 60
Thanked 27 Times in 27 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pops71lives View Post
I've read through several posts and at this point I may be suffering from brain drain. I have the body back on the frame and the rear of the door is to high to close the door at the rear upper portion. Looking at the dooe it would be the top right corner. I noted the shims and replaced exactly the same as they were at removal. Any thoughts? Several hours today messing with shim placement/removal. Little frustration setting in. To complicate matters cage nut number 2 decided to start spinning on itself so I have to address that somehow.
Not my particular area of expertise. However, out of curiosity, did you replace any/all body mounts as part of your project? If so, there's an excellent thread on aligning body/fenders/doors via shimming body mounts somewhere in recent threads (somewhere inside of a month I think). Do a quick search on that and I think you'll bump into it.

If not that, then I'm pretty sure someone here in this forum will offer up some sage advice. There's a whole lot of very knowledgeable folks here that have given me very good advice on all sorts of Vette related issues.
binx is offline   Reply w/quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-08-2014, 02:59 AM   #3
Pops71lives
DC Crew
 
Pops71lives's Avatar
 
Posts: 726
Member #132985
Member since: Oct 2013
Location: Goshen/Indiana/USA

My Corvette(s)
1971

Thanks: 245
Thanked 106 Times in 96 Posts
All hardware including cushions and spacers are new. My guess is this is a lesson in patience.
Pops71lives is offline   Reply w/quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-08-2014, 06:34 AM   #4
slofut
DC Crew
 
slofut's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,838
Member #119762
Member since: Sep 2012
Location: Home of grits and gnats, Moultrie, Ga.

My Corvette(s)
1971 base conv. GTO LS1, T56.

Thanks: 413
Thanked 127 Times in 118 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pops71lives View Post
All hardware including cushions and spacers are new. My guess is this is a lesson in patience.
Your guess is correct.
As I learned in school, you align the rear section on the frame and work forwards. As the rear door jamb and the sill are an angle in one piece, you align the rear gap first, then align the front fender to the front of the door. Works fine with steel bodied cars with adjustable fenders.
On my vette, keeping in mind no body-off, I put the drivers door back on, put the striker on loosely, and centered the door in the opening as best I could so that the height was correct (height adj in the door, fore aft adj in the cowl) and it would close fairly close at the back. Then aligned the striker to the door loosely but so it would latch. Then, with the door closed and latched, I loosened all the hinge bolts, and from the outside I could see where it needed to go. I used wood shims under the door between the door and sill to get height close then shifted fore and aft with wood pry tools to get it close, then got in the car from the other side and tightened the cowl bolts.
I got lucky and it was pretty close and only took some minor tweeking after this. All in all about 45 min.

NOW, on the passenger side, I now have probably 5 hrs time in alignment over a period of several days and it's def not perfect! But it's as good as it will get. The final alignment on that side will have to be finished with fiberglass and filler.

On the pass side, I went from adding shims from original, to subtracting shims from what they were originally, and up down and back and forth a million times. The top-front door fender gap looks like crap on my car. But I'm not realigning fenders to fix it!

Last edited by slofut; 12-08-2014 at 07:38 AM.
slofut is offline   Reply w/quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-08-2014, 07:17 AM   #5
wabco40
DC Crew
 
wabco40's Avatar
 
Posts: 37
Member #62668
Member since: Jul 2007
Location: Perth / WA / Australia

My Corvette(s)
1971

Thanks: 7
Thanked 9 Times in 8 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pops71lives View Post
I've read through several posts and at this point I may be suffering from brain drain. I have the body back on the frame and the rear of the door is to high to close the door at the rear upper portion. Looking at the dooe it would be the top right corner. I noted the shims and replaced exactly the same as they were at removal. Any thoughts? Several hours today messing with shim placement/removal. Little frustration setting in. To complicate matters cage nut number 2 decided to start spinning on itself so I have to address that somehow.
If the back of the door is sitting high What does your door gaping look like?
Is it even or wider at the top. How about the front door to fender gap? Is this even or wider at the bottom
Have you tried to adjust the door at the hinges? By loosening the bolts on the A pillar and in the front of the door it can be adjusted up or down, forward or back or tilted. Also the striker pin can be loosened and positioned to suit.
When I put the body back onto my frame I adjust the door hinges and the striker pin to fit the door the best I could. I then made slight adjustments with the body shims to set the gaps. By removing a shim from #3 mount will slightly close the gap at the top of the door rear and open it at the bottom. The opposite will happen by adding a shim. However I should imagine there is a limit on how far this can be done!!!
There are also shims under the the hinges, these allow the door to be tilted in or out. From memory the hinge bolt holes on the A pillar are slotted length ways and the bolt holes in the front of the door are slotted up and down.
Once all the adjustments are understood then it's not that hard to get the doors fitting well.
wabco40 is offline   Reply w/quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-08-2014, 02:31 PM   #6
Pops71lives
DC Crew
 
Pops71lives's Avatar
 
Posts: 726
Member #132985
Member since: Oct 2013
Location: Goshen/Indiana/USA

My Corvette(s)
1971

Thanks: 245
Thanked 106 Times in 96 Posts
Good thoughts and I appreiate the info. I think what I am going to have to do is hoist the body..Replace the cage bolts after I cut the spinner on #2 and start over. I think I have things far enough out it would be beneficial to start fresh. I tried using the hinge adjustments but it's too far off. I really wish I had replaced the nuts when the body was off. I checked and rethreaded after powder coating and they felt pretty good. Clearly I was wrong.
Pops71lives is offline   Reply w/quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-09-2014, 10:02 AM   #7
Sly Vette
DC Crew
 
Sly Vette's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,071
Member #118014
Member since: Nov 2011
Location: S/E Mich.

My Corvette(s)
1969 Convertible

Thanks: 115
Thanked 91 Times in 81 Posts
I followed the same procedure as Slofut,using wood shims along the way. I am convinced that even if you take note of the shim stack at each mounting point it will still take a fair amount of tweaking to get it right. The body just seems to be too flexable.
Just another in a long list of things that the steel body guys don't have to deal with...
Sly Vette is offline   Reply w/quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-09-2014, 04:42 PM   #8
slofut
DC Crew
 
slofut's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,838
Member #119762
Member since: Sep 2012
Location: Home of grits and gnats, Moultrie, Ga.

My Corvette(s)
1971 base conv. GTO LS1, T56.

Thanks: 413
Thanked 127 Times in 118 Posts
Another consideration...
With my doors closed, pick it up with my 2 post lift at the rear crossmember in front of the tires, and at the curve under the gills, and the rear door gap at the top opens about 3/8 inch! Frame flexes a lot, so I got to where I would adjust then shake the car around and re-check. Don't try to adjust doors unless it's sitting firmly on 4 wheels and settled.
slofut is offline   Reply w/quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-09-2014, 08:43 PM   #9
Pops71lives
DC Crew
 
Pops71lives's Avatar
 
Posts: 726
Member #132985
Member since: Oct 2013
Location: Goshen/Indiana/USA

My Corvette(s)
1971

Thanks: 245
Thanked 106 Times in 96 Posts
I'll certianly use some of the mentioned tips and tricks. I spent about 4 hours in the garage last night and removed #2. I may have invented some new swear words.The plan is to weld new cage nut and use the suggestions. I think a fresh look will help as well. For just a few minutes there sanity was in question. Thank you guys very much for the info., it is appreciated.
Pops71lives is offline   Reply w/quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-10-2014, 04:20 AM   #10
binx
DC Crew
 
Posts: 247
Member #127929
Member since: Jul 2013
Location: Hawaii

My Corvette(s)
1973 Stingray

Thanks: 60
Thanked 27 Times in 27 Posts
I've seen a couple of friends use an engine hoist, leveler and 1" nylon straps to support and adjust angles when installing doors.

Just say'in.
binx is offline   Reply w/quote Quick reply to this message
The Following User Says Thank You to binx For This Useful Post:
Pops71lives (12-10-2014)
Old 12-10-2014, 06:14 AM   #11
slofut
DC Crew
 
slofut's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,838
Member #119762
Member since: Sep 2012
Location: Home of grits and gnats, Moultrie, Ga.

My Corvette(s)
1971 base conv. GTO LS1, T56.

Thanks: 413
Thanked 127 Times in 118 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by binx View Post
I've seen a couple of friends use an engine hoist, leveler and 1" nylon straps to support and adjust angles when installing doors.

Just say'in.
Yep, and a floor jack and a block of wood comes in handy also, to serve as an extra pair of hands.
slofut is offline   Reply w/quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-10-2014, 10:58 AM   #12
69MyWay
DC Crew
 
69MyWay's Avatar
 
Posts: 4,751
Member #2007
Member since: Aug 2003
Location: Clinton, IL

My Corvette(s)
Vetteless in the Midwest...at least for now

Thanks: 13
Thanked 99 Times in 76 Posts
i think you are getting great advice here.

Just FYI - I feel for ya, because I'm doing the first real rough fit of the doors on her 69 vert. Considering I replaced the bird cage with a 78 - mixed and matched many other parts including re-skinned the doors with 1975 skins...everything has moved.

I used the wood shim under the door frame to the rocker to do the initial set. I also had the bolts backed off and went through several shim variations until I found one I liked. I'm also in the process of grinding and filling the door gap on the body side to perfect it.

Now...I'm doing the panel to panel check and fill - to get it to look as if it was all carved out of one complete sheet of glass.

yes, the bushings and shims will change things too - and for each place you make an adjustment another will need to be considered.

Don't forget to put your door striker in - you want to make sure it will properly latch at the place you set it.

Good luck and have fun. This is a HUGE detail that is worth taking your time.
69MyWay is offline   Reply w/quote Quick reply to this message
The Following User Says Thank You to 69MyWay For This Useful Post:
Pops71lives (12-10-2014)
Old 12-12-2014, 06:55 AM   #13
slofut
DC Crew
 
slofut's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,838
Member #119762
Member since: Sep 2012
Location: Home of grits and gnats, Moultrie, Ga.

My Corvette(s)
1971 base conv. GTO LS1, T56.

Thanks: 413
Thanked 127 Times in 118 Posts
Scott,
Don't forget... the shims adjust the door in and out on plane with the front fender and the rear quarter, that's all. If you have too many shims you'll have the door sitting proud of the fender and likely a conflict at the pointy part that'll crack paint or worse when you open it. Also, the door striker isn't used to lift the rear of the door or for alignment other than the depth that the door closes into the rear jamb. Fwiw, on the passenger door my lower fore-aft adjustment in the cowl is all the way to the rear, the pic of the see-thru C3 I noticed that pass door is the same.
How's it coming?
Bill

Last edited by slofut; 12-12-2014 at 07:40 AM.
slofut is offline   Reply w/quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-12-2014, 11:02 AM   #14
Pops71lives
DC Crew
 
Pops71lives's Avatar
 
Posts: 726
Member #132985
Member since: Oct 2013
Location: Goshen/Indiana/USA

My Corvette(s)
1971

Thanks: 245
Thanked 106 Times in 96 Posts
Game plan - I got the bolt out. New cage nuts arrived yesterday. Just turned the heater on in the garage, took an early day. Hoist the car, remove mounts # 3 and 4. Clean areas. Weld new ones on in the am and reset body with a clean slate. Using the tips and ideas you guys gave me is a huge help. Will try and get the door "rough aligned" in the morning and post some pics. The afternoon is Army Navy. have to be done by game time. Go Navy!
Scott
Pops71lives is offline   Reply w/quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-12-2014, 11:20 AM   #15
slofut
DC Crew
 
slofut's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,838
Member #119762
Member since: Sep 2012
Location: Home of grits and gnats, Moultrie, Ga.

My Corvette(s)
1971 base conv. GTO LS1, T56.

Thanks: 413
Thanked 127 Times in 118 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pops71lives View Post
Game plan - I got the bolt out. New cage nuts arrived yesterday. Just turned the heater on in the garage, took an early day. Hoist the car, remove mounts # 3 and 4. Clean areas. Weld new ones on in the am and reset body with a clean slate. Using the tips and ideas you guys gave me is a huge help. Will try and get the door "rough aligned" in the morning and post some pics. The afternoon is Army Navy. have to be done by game time. Go Navy!
Scott
Need a tv in the shop!!
slofut is offline   Reply w/quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Corvette Forum : DigitalCorvettes.com Corvette Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name (12 CHARACTERS MAXIMUM), your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:
City / State / Country?
Where you live
What kind of Corvette(s) do you own?
This field is not required.
Insurance
Please select your insurance company (Optional)

Log-in


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.2

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:38 AM.




Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Garage Plus vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
2003-2011, DigitalCorvettes.com - All Rights Reserved