[niels007]

Hi guys,

Unlike what seems to be most of you guys here, I'm not really in a position to drive a real Vette. I do play some computer simulations and a friend has made a really hot looking C6 for this simulation called rFactor. Here are some pics, excuse the Imageshack popups that might occur..:

http://img91.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rfc6005kz1.jpg

http://img525.imageshack.us/my.php?image=rfc6004ta0.jpg

It looks hot, but the next step is to make it drive hot! The cool thing about rFactor is that it really goes far beyond your playstation. You can model multilink suspensions, play with the load sensitivity of the tyres, tweak the differential.. You really 'build' a car so to speak.

So for starters I would like to find out a few general parameters that I haven't found sofar of a 'stock' C6, or something close.. Things like:

- Wheelrates (i.e. springrate measured at each of the 4 wheels)
- Damping rates
- Rollbar rates
- has anyone measured how high the centre of gravity is in a C6?

Thinks like detailed suspension geometry would be great as well. The simulation can model things like slight grip variations with camber, even though tyre data is very very hard to find..

The more the merrier!

As it progresses I'll hopefully make some videos and youtube 'em so you can see just how cool and hopefully realistic this virtual C6 is gonna be...

Thanks!
/Niels

 

[biturbo]

The rendering looks pretty good.
But that's the easy part.
The detailed technical data you are asking for is hard to find.

Just FYI there is at least one game I know, PGR3 for Xbox360 that has the C6 and the C6 Z06 with excellent physics/simulations.
Also Forza 2 is coming with even better simulation.

 

[niels007]

Hi Biturbo,

Somehow that name reminds me of some GT porsche 911s of a few years ago.. scary beasts...

Yes, the C6 or close enough is in a few games. Even though some of these games are 'ok', they always exaggerate grip levels to accomodate the casual player on the sofa with his / her gamepad. A main problem about games or even simulations is that they rely on false tyre data, using grip curves that drop a LOT after a 'peak' grip is reached. In reality, this drop is quite mild; the sensation of the car letting go is more caused by the grip no longer building up! It is more of a 'plateau' after the 'peak' than a 40% drop.

Test Drive Unlimited is a good example, after 100000000s hours of driving you can unlock a 'hardcore' mode, which probably makes the car pull realistic G's, however they use those tyre grip curves from Mars, so as soon as you slide, there is no more grip available. This tyre stuff is a BIG misconception in Car guru / simulation guru land. Luckily with rFactor, you can draw your own grip curves and decide on peak slip angles etc etc..

Even without accurate data I'm sure this C06 will be a lot better than the one you can drive in those games.

rFactor can be used with MOTEC software, pretty hardcore telemetry stuff, and when you tune the tyres to give you 1.1 .. 1.2 G lateral and 1.2 .. 1.3 longitudinal, things become a lot more 'interesting'. You have to be carefull with your inputs, especially at higher speeds.. But with 'good' tyre grip curves and decent enough values, there is some live over the limit. Its twitchy but won't immediately kill you if you practise a bit..

 

[niels007]

A little update for those interested, however few that may be..

It is going quite well, the car now matches the Car & Driver 0..60, 1/4 mile and 150mph points, and it pulls the average 0.98G on a flat skidpad. For now I'm using suspension frequencies of about 1.7hz on the front and 1.6 on the back, the roll rate is about 1.65 degrees per lateral G. The tyres work quite well.

On a skidpad in 2nd gear, its fairly easy to get the back out. In 3rd gear you can trow the car a bit but unless the road 'drops' a bit or has quick camber 'let go', you can't sustain a true powerslide in 3rd. You'd need the 505HP Z06 for that I'd say..

Experienced drivers can drive it with mild understeer and chance of power oversteer on the track, without really going crazy. In ''Tiff Needell mode'' you can leave smoke into, and out of 2nd gear turns as if tyres cost no money..

Hang on.. virtual tyres *cost no money*.. :laughing:

Youtube to follow one of these days..

/Niels

PS: Weight distribution is conflicting.. C&D says 46.3% rear, other sources boast 49% rear. I found it harder to get the 0..60 and 1/4 mile times with 46.3%, but what is the definitive number?

PS2: Does anyone have a G meter in their C6? C&D specs the 70 mph stop to take 166ft, which, if I made no mistake, is more or less 1G. I'm struggling a bit because if I give the tyres a longitudinal grip of about 1G, the back steps out too easy on the power. My limited knowledge always said tyres are more happy in longitudinal direction than lateral, so why does it turn 0.98G on a skidpad and also stop at about 1G? Are the brakes not quite good enough?

 

[RTGordon]

The car truly is 51/49, probably exactly 50/50 with driver based on seating position with a Cg closer to the rear wheels. As far as braking, remember that braking distance does not increase linearly with speed; it is an exponential relationship. That means that at high speed you aren't producing nearly the G forces you are as your speed slows. Your coefficient of kinetic friction also varies because you have higher temps at high speed as well as different contact geometry (less tire in contact with pavement). Your deceleration curve looks more like a flattened parabola centered at time (0) and increasing up until the point that the vehicle stops.

 

[biturbo]

You guys should model the 2008 C6, why doing an older car?

 

[niels007]

Here is a early preview video trying some provocative driving. Still a bit of work to do and some problems to solve. Bear in mind that in the virtual world there is no fear of crashing; I'd not be so confident in a real C6..

Due to the way the game works, there is no skid sound here

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZDu7oXAEm8

 

[niels007]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AM3uiUQlh4c

on board video with some comments on the balance of it all.. That'll be it for me here, if anyone wants to know more or keep up to date, mail notification for this thread is on so I'll notice..

/Niels

 

[some1]

Hey Niels, a little surprise was to see you here :laughing:

Anyways, I didn't want to make a new thread, because I think it would be better to gather all the needed stuff for this virtual C6 in one thread.

I'm modeling the C6, and I'm desperately looking for reference pics of the 7-spoke and 15-spoke wheels (optional wheel styles found on www.chevrolet.com). Also, any ref pics of the newer 2007 Corvette rims would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance, and those who would like to save some gas and the environment, try out the C6 that will be available for rFactor racing simulation any time soon

 

[some1]

Still looking for any reference pictures of the new 7 spoke and 15 spoke wheels... help anybody?

 

[excessive81]

wow that pretty cool. sounds good that for sure. forza is out. every data point you could ever want is in that thing

 

[wcdove]

Hey Niels, a little surprise was to see you here :laughing:

Anyways, I didn't want to make a new thread, because I think it would be better to gather all the needed stuff for this virtual C6 in one thread.

I'm modeling the C6, and I'm desperately looking for reference pics of the 7-spoke and 15-spoke wheels (optional wheel styles found on www.chevrolet.com). Also, any ref pics of the newer 2007 Corvette rims would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance, and those who would like to save some gas and the environment, try out the C6 that will be available for rFactor racing simulation any time soon

11 months later so you may already have found what you need. I happened to be looking for info on the 15 spoke wheel and saw this thread. I just found this GMPartsDirect.com link and there is a picture of the wheel.

http://www.gmpartsdirect.com/results.cfm?singlepart=1&partnumber=pkck6900


GM PART # PKCK6900
CATEGORY: Accessories & Misc.
PACK QTY: 1
CORE CHARGE: $0.00
GM LIST: $3,443.39
OUR PRICE: $2,482.38