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Discussion Starter #1
With the upcoming lame duck session slated to decide the fate of tax cuts, it becomes class warfare again. A great new article reminds us that the rich are already soaked pretty good:

"The Tax Foundation, which exercises impartial oversight over the numbers, says the top 5 percent of taxpayers in 2008 (adjusted gross income, $156,619) earned 34.7 percent of AGI while paying 58.7 percent of federal individual income taxes. The top 1 percent paid 38.02 percent of all taxes, whereas the bottom 50 percent (adjusted gross income of $33,408) paid 2.70 percent."

Good read: http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2010/11/17/the_tax_rate_racket_107984.html
 

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I am all for repealing all the tax cuts. After all aren't we all upset about the huge deficits? Extending the tax breaks will add huge amounts to the deficit. Is that what you want? I thought all the conservatives on here are going nuts about the deficit yet they want the tax cuts extended. It just makes no sense. Now I am sure that the conservative answere is cut spending. I am all for that too. Lets start by getting rid of Social security. I will do just fine without it and so will you if it is gone. How about Medicare. Why do we force our seniors into socialized medicine if it not good enough for us.

Just don't give me that bullshit about removing waste and fraud to solve this problem. That is a sure sign of someone who is trying to fool you into thinking this problem can be solved without any pain. Anybody who has lived beyond their means for too long will suffer from the correction. We are not exempt from this reality.
 

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Grey Squirrel
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Extend the tax cuts for all. It has been demonstrated time and time again that low taxes result in record government revenue. Cutting taxes, cutting spending, and cutting wasteful programs will go a long way in restoring economic prosperity.

On the other hand, why not institute a national sales tax, eliminate the tax cuts, and raise all other current taxes in an effort to tax our way to prosperity....... that'll work, won't it?
 

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Discussion Starter #4
I am all for repealing all the tax cuts. After all aren't we all upset about the huge deficits? Extending the tax breaks will add huge amounts to the deficit. Is that what you want? I thought all the conservatives on here are going nuts about the deficit yet they want the tax cuts extended. It just makes no sense. Now I am sure that the conservative answere is cut spending. I am all for that too. Lets start by getting rid of Social security. I will do just fine without it and so will you if it is gone. How about Medicare. Why do we force our seniors into socialized medicine if it not good enough for us.

Just don't give me that bullshit about removing waste and fraud to solve this problem. That is a sure sign of someone who is trying to fool you into thinking this problem can be solved without any pain. Anybody who has lived beyond their means for too long will suffer from the correction. We are not exempt from this reality.
There are two ways to raise tax revenue. You can raise marginal rates as you suggest, and be guaranteed to lose much of your increased revenue as a result of slowing down the economy and the resultant drop in revenues that follows. Or you can keep taxes as low as possible, encourage business and commerce, and fire up the economy so that revenues skyrocket. This is exactly what happened after the deep recession of the 80's and the tech boom that nearly wiped out our deficit. It wasn't high taxes that made Clinton look like a genius, it was a hot economy.
 

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Extend the tax cuts for all. It has been demonstrated time and time again that low taxes result in record government revenue. Cutting taxes, cutting spending, and cutting wasteful programs will go a long way in restoring economic prosperity.

On the other hand, why not institute a national sales tax, eliminate the tax cuts, and raise all other current taxes in an effort to tax our way to prosperity....... that'll work, won't it?
Perhaps I am confused, but didn't we have the largest tax cut in history 10 years ago. And didn't our deficit explode durring all of those years. And wasn't the economy pretty lackluster durring most of those years ending in the worst recession since the great depresion.

You cannot raise spending like on two wars and huge increases on medicare and cut taxes and expect everything to be all rosy. If you increse spending you have to increase income....so simple, yet so allusive to those claiming to be conservative. So if you want to balance the budget today you have to cut spending and increase taxes. The spending cuts help to stop the increase in our debt. The tax increases pay for what we should have been paying all along.
 

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There are two ways to raise tax revenue. You can raise marginal rates as you suggest, and be guaranteed to lose much of your increased revenue as a result of slowing down the economy and the resultant drop in revenues that follows. Or you can keep taxes as low as possible, encourage business and commerce, and fire up the economy so that revenues skyrocket. This is exactly what happened after the deep recession of the 80's and the tech boom that nearly wiped out our deficit. It wasn't high taxes that made Clinton look like a genius, it was a hot economy.
And exactly the boom that you speak of came about after the largest tax increase in history, by Bill Clinton. And that was after GH Bush increased taxes too. So two tax hikes and then a huge boom in the economy. 1 Huge tax cut and we end up in the worst recession since the great depresion.

Thank you for proving my point. :thumbsup:
 

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Grey Squirrel
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Perhaps I am confused, but didn't we have the largest tax cut in history 10 years ago. And didn't our deficit explode durring all of those years. And wasn't the economy pretty lackluster durring most of those years ending in the worst recession since the great depresion.

You cannot raise spending like on two wars and huge increases on medicare and cut taxes and expect everything to be all rosy. If you increse spending you have to increase income....so simple, yet so allusive to those claiming to be conservative. So if you want to balance the budget today you have to cut spending and increase taxes. The spending cuts help to stop the increase in our debt. The tax increases pay for what we should have been paying all along.
After taxes were cut we had 42 straight months of economic growth and unemployment hovered around 5% for that time. We ended up with a huge deficit because spending was out of control. The deficit continues to rise because this administration continues to spend out of control. Taxing people to death won't do anything to spur the economy or tackle the deficit because it ill further slow the economy. The only way to get it under control is to cut spending to bare bones and keep the tax cuts so the economy can thrive.
 

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If the taxers (D)'s want to try to eliminate the deficit through more taxes, I could see that on the surface that would work. BUT, it would ONLY work IF they suspended the spending. What WILL happen, as it's happened EVERY time is this. They will say they will halt all new spending, until they get the money, then they will fund and spend even MORE. None of the new revenue will go towards the deficit. They will just increase it through more spending.
 

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There are two ways to raise tax revenue. You can raise marginal rates as you suggest, and be guaranteed to lose much of your increased revenue as a result of slowing down the economy and the resultant drop in revenues that follows. Or you can keep taxes as low as possible, encourage business and commerce, and fire up the economy so that revenues skyrocket. This is exactly what happened after the deep recession of the 80's and the tech boom that nearly wiped out our deficit. It wasn't high taxes that made Clinton look like a genius, it was a hot economy.

That's blasphemy talk to the left! :laughing:
 

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Discussion Starter #10
And exactly the boom that you speak of came about after the largest tax increase in history, by Bill Clinton. And that was after GH Bush increased taxes too. So two tax hikes and then a huge boom in the economy. 1 Huge tax cut and we end up in the worst recession since the great depresion.

Thank you for proving my point. :thumbsup:
No, what your statement proves is that tax rates are not the ONLY thing that determines the deficit. Geopolitics is important too, as are many other factors.
 

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If the taxers (D)'s want to try to eliminate the deficit through more taxes, I could see that on the surface that would work. BUT, it would ONLY work IF they suspended the spending. What WILL happen, as it's happened EVERY time is this. They will say they will halt all new spending, until they get the money, then they will fund and spend even MORE. None of the new revenue will go towards the deficit. They will just increase it through more spending.
Exactly. :thumbsup:

I say continue the the tax cuts for all...let the people keep their money and cut spending accross the board.
 

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Why is it that everytime a tax cut is discussed from the left it's always going to create more debt? Why is it that when spending increases it's so quiet from the left? Where was the talk of incresing the deficit when all the new spending was going on? The problem is spending. Not revenue. I know it's more complicated than that but to keep it simple. And it's true that letting people keep more of what they earn will help the economy more than letting the tax cuts expire.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Why is it that everytime a tax cut is discussed from the left it's always going to create more debt? Why is it that when spending increases it's so quiet from the left? Where was the talk of incresing the deficit when all the new spending was going on? The problem is spending. Not revenue. I know it's more complicated than that but to keep it simple. And it's true that letting people keep more of what they earn will help the economy more than letting the tax cuts expire.
Actually, there WAS talk of overspending during the Pub reign. The likes of Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity complained loud and long about Republican overspending between 1994 and 2006 when they had control. But like all good politicians, they spent like drunken sailors simply because they could and the recipients all gave them big pats on the back. Basically, the hope is that the new Tea Party influenced Republican Party has learned it's lessons and will be willing to take the political heat for significantly cutting spending. Some tax increases may be needed too, but if they are, everyone needs to pay - not just one income group.
 

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I am all for repealing all the tax cuts. After all aren't we all upset about the huge deficits? Extending the tax breaks will add huge amounts to the deficit.
Feel free to do your part and send in more this year. :rolling:
 

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Actually, there WAS talk of overspending during the Pub reign. The likes of Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity complained loud and long about Republican overspending between 1994 and 2006 when they had control. But like all good politicians, they spent like drunken sailors simply because they could and the recipients all gave them big pats on the back. Basically, the hope is that the new Tea Party influenced Republican Party has learned it's lessons and will be willing to take the political heat for significantly cutting spending. Some tax increases may be needed too, but if they are, everyone needs to pay - not just one income group.
I agree the Pubs were doing the same thing but not to the extent of the last 2 years. And with all the gnashing of teeth from the left about extending the tax cuts all of a sudden it will increse the deficit. My point was the spending over the last 2 years was OK with the left but now all of a sudden it's important to them that we will sink deeper into debt because of the tax cuts being extended. The deficit coupled with the lethargic economy is a no win. The only way to get the economy moving again is by people willing to spend again. Taking more from them at this point will do the opposite. JMHO
 

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Discussion Starter #16
I agree the Pubs were doing the same thing but not to the extent of the last 2 years. And with all the gnashing of teeth from the left about extending the tax cuts all of a sudden it will increse the deficit. My point was the spending over the last 2 years was OK with the left but now all of a sudden it's important to them that we will sink deeper into debt because of the tax cuts being extended. The deficit coupled with the lethargic economy is a no win. The only way to get the economy moving again is by people willing to spend again. Taking more from them at this point will do the opposite. JMHO
:agree:
 

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That's blasphemy talk to the left! :laughing:
And it's pure bullshit to a true fiscal conservative. The trickle down economic model failed. Even Ronald Reagan the first advocate for trickle down economics gave up on it durring his term. He cut taxes to the bone his first year then increased them every year after.

Of course the Republicans stopped being fiscal conservatives long ago about the time they became bible thumping conservatives.
 

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End the Fed, repeal the 16th, enjoy prosperity.

There were no tax cuts. Every "cut" was an attempt to return to what the progressives promised. There has never been a tax cut in the history of the 16th amendment. Anyone who tells you there has been, is full of bullshit.
 

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End the Fed, repeal the 16th, enjoy prosperity.

There were no tax cuts. Every "cut" was an attempt to return to what the progressives promised. There has never been a tax cut in the history of the 16th amendment. Anyone who tells you there has been, is full of bullshit.
:partyon:
 
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