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Many of you remember when Chris Bangle redesigned the rear end on the 7 series BMW. The faithful wanted to burn him at the stake. Owners screamed and cried for a year or two. Now he's considered a design hero. Even GM has that trunk bussle" on the Malibu.
http://jalopnik.com/we-were-all-wrong-chris-bangle-was-a-prophet-1664079107
FWIW, the Malibu is continually losing market share and despite the recent minor makeover, GM has been frantically working on a complete radical redesign that they hope will catch and surpass the contemporary designs at Ford, Kia, Mazda, and Chrysler.

Besides, if Bangle had placed elk horns on the hood of all BMWs, there would now be all variations of animal antlers, horns, and racks (no, not the twin peaks kind of racks) adorning wannabe bimmers throughout the industry.
 

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FWIW, the Malibu is continually losing market share and despite the recent minor makeover, GM has been frantically working on a complete radical redesign that they hope will catch and surpass the contemporary designs at Ford, Kia, Mazda, and Chrysler.

Besides, if Bangle had placed elk horns on the hood of all BMWs, there would now be all variations of animal antlers, horns, and racks (no, not the twin peaks kind of racks) adorning wannabe bimmers throughout the industry.
There are many reasons for that (the car got smaller and is splitting sales with Impala), but the car definitely has some issues. That's why a new one will be shown this year.
 

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There are many reasons for that (the car got smaller and is splitting sales with Impala), but the car definitely has some issues. That's why a new one will be shown this year.
So putting a Bangle Butt on the Malibu was not a magic sales potion. Yes some of the lesser imaginative design centers for I-want-to-be-a-bimmer manufactures have followed the bogus bangle butt, while others didn't and have been pretty successful in not following the crowd:
Kia sales have taken off since their sculptured design showed up in the showroom and the Ford Fusion has gained significant market share since wth their current design. VW's CC has also done well.

I sure didn't need to get used to the look of the C2 or the XKE or the early '70s Chevelle SS 396/427/454 or plenty of other newer, and older designs I could name - some of which I'm sure you would hate. Some folks learn to love their arranged marriage partners too, looks and all. I suppose there must be some folks that miss a wart when it is removed. Not saying this applies in any way to you. For me, just because I might get used to seeing something, it doesn't make it beautiful, or even acceptable. Hell, I'm used to seeing congressmen on the news every night. Doesn't mean I believe a damn word they say and not one of them is beautiful. AH...can't imagine why this came to mind right after the congressman comment, but plenty of guys get hair plugs (maybe eventually they look OK) but they sure aren't beautiful when you spot a fresh set of plugs.

Regardless, we can (and we have in the past) gone back and forth on our preferences all day, or all month. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. If you like it buy it. If you don't, don't.
 

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So putting a Bangle Butt on the Malibu was not a magic sales potion. Yes some of the lesser imaginative design centers for I-want-to-be-a-bimmer manufactures have followed the bogus bangle butt, while others didn't and have been pretty successful in not following the crowd:
Kia sales have taken off since their sculptured design showed up in the showroom and the Ford Fusion has gained significant market share since wth their current design. VW's CC has also done well.

I sure didn't need to get used to the look of the C2 or the XKE or the early '70s Chevelle SS 396/427/454 or plenty of other newer, and older designs I could name - some of which I'm sure you would hate. Some folks learn to love their arranged marriage partners too, looks and all. I suppose there must be some folks that miss a wart when it is removed. Not saying this applies in any way to you. For me, just because I might get used to seeing something, it doesn't make it beautiful, or even acceptable. Hell, I'm used to seeing congressmen on the news every night. Doesn't mean I believe a damn word they say and not one of them is beautiful. AH...can't imagine why this came to mind right after the congressman comment, but plenty of guys get hair plugs (maybe eventually they look OK) but they sure aren't beautiful when you spot a fresh set of plugs.

Regardless, we can (and we have in the past) gone back and forth on our preferences all day, or all month. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. If you like it buy it. If you don't, don't.
Looks are not what is killing Malibu. The issue is the car got smaller (on the inside) and is not putting up great numbers (for it's class) in virtually any metric.

Take Camry for example, it's never really been a looker, but it sells on branding and relative performance. A car doesn't have to look fantastic to sell, it's just got to have good press. Malibu took a beating on the small back seat and didn't have any other class leading measures (except interior noise) to make up for it. What this will do is hopefully give Malibu a fresh reboot, address the big issues, and give GM an chance to improve it's performance numbers in what might be the most competitive segment.

Fusion isn't selling as well now, I think the problem it has is that the looks got dated pretty quickly.

Kia is selling because they have decent performance numbers and will literally finance to anyone.
 

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Ok. The Bangal Butt was/is a fad that had little or not impact on actual sales.

IMO, it demonstrated the high level of influence that BMW is able to exercise in the industry. Even Bangal steadily softened the butt after the initial 7 series extreme until it is just about gone.
2002


2015


You think he was inspired by this?

;)
 

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I placed a link to this thread in the moderator's section and requested a ne C8 section. I stated there that I don't think it is fair to the C7 Folks to have C8 discussions in their section.

I haven't gotten any feedback from the bosses yet.

At the risk of sounding needy, if you guys want to start a C8 section and move this thread into it, let us know by either liking this post or posting that you want a C8 section.

I'll pass the number of positive responses along to the top mucky muck and let the numbers influence the decision.

...or not if you guys think it is too soon.
In the past, once we start getting spy shots - even of mules - the information base starts to heat up. FWIW
 

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I'm not sure, but do I keep seeing a new Sonota or maybe a Fusion in your second pic?
The bangal butt is pretty much gone in the second pic. In fact I think - maybe you were saying this - that Bangal let the Sonata influence his 2015 7 series.



 

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Back on Topic the C8 ... naaah

The new Mali-vette with round taillights




Damn if that isn't a pontiac logo in the middle of the rear wheel. Maybe this really is the SS?!!??

But the cabin seems to clearly be Malibu



OH, look at the width of the rear tire versus the front. RWD = SS ... or more of a cammo trick?
 

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I for one think we should start a C8 Section and let strictly C7 stuff be posted here. As you indicated, it's only fair to the C7 guys.

Hopefully more spy pics will surface soon to justify having new section.

I also always look forward to the renderings
 

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I have mixed feelings about renderings. The early SWAG renderings are distracting and can become irritating. They sell magazines but have zero chance of looking like the production car. There are lots of guys out there with talent and the time to put their ideas into a rendering, but those are not GM's ideas. And if we like them we start to build our hopes and expectations upon a look that won't happen.

For example, here is the C&D very smooth and very clean (maybe too much so) C8 rendering that includes 4 big , round taillights (wow! where did they get that idea!!). Do you really think this would come out of Welburn's studio?

 

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I'm trying to figure out where to put a C7. I need a bigger garage. I'll have to trade one of my 04's down the line. I am shocked how quick the magnetic red one is being an auto. I bought it 2 months ago with 40K miles for my DD. It has the perf. gears and it kina hauls ass. Very impressed so far! Don't worry LT. there is no way I'm selling the 427 vert.:D It has 550 miles now.
Here is a phone pic I took 10 min ago, very sunny here so its not good.


 

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You got some great looking cars there - and sun!

I'm jealous. It's ~10:00 AM here and we STILL have fog - a lot of it. Unusual in So Cal. Oh, we have fog occasionally, but it's usually burned off well before 10. I'm sure it'll be gone before Lunch! It was top down / targa off weather this last weekend!
 

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First thought after seeing the photo?

El Camino has returned! :devil:
Same here....I've seen enough drawings of them and the stories of the Holden/El Camino coming soon?, well, they're just that.....until I saw those spy shots.


It looks like anything but a mid-engine 'vette
 

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It looks like anything but a mid-engine 'vette
No offense, but that's kinda the point > Cammo. But your right, that is definitely a dry sump engine that is tucked down low behind the cabin to keep that rear profile low. Great center of gravity.

Word is, that under the Holden Ute rear, the C7 midsection and the shortened Holden front, sits the C7 Al frame. Somehow, they designed the frame to be able to accept different cradles for front and rear while enabling the cabin to move forward. That might help explain why they did away with the one piece Hydro-formed Rails - so they could do some massaging with the wheel base (?).

...or "word" is wrong. :huh:


The frame looks easy to extend in the back. Bet it's just as easy to shorten up front.
 

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I have mixed feelings about renderings. The early SWAG renderings are distracting and can become irritating....... There are lots of guys out there with talent and the time to put their ideas into a rendering, but those are not GM's ideas. And if we like them we start to build our hopes and expectations upon a look that won't happen.

I totally get your meaning, but I for one has never expected ANY magazine to guess correctly at what a next Gen Vette will look like. In my 42 years of existance I've never seen it happen. They even generalize the "facts" about an imminent generation: "more power, better handling, more options, new tech". What I do love seeing is another fan's take on what they think the next Vette will look like. All in good fun , that's all. Sort of like the wish lists that's happened on this forum and others before.

An aside: on the other forum a question was posted last year to owners of C7s asking them what they would add/change about their sportscars. An incredibly large percentage of respondants said "power operated trunk" !!!
 

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Yes, very likely a C7 supplier worker leaked it to Jalopnik and Patrick's connections had already shown it to him so he confirmed it. But it wasn't until MUCH later that the other leaks came. You will recall that close to the release there was a supplier SNAFU that posted the molds for the front and rear fascia on their website. There were also CAD-type engineering drawings leaked from (if you believe the story) a very big Vette dealer. We have been told that GM immediately tightened their supplier agreements, among other security steps, to try to prevent a repeat. The vast majority of the pre-release C7 spy pics were C6 bodied.

Regardless, there will be C8 leaks at some point. There are too many suppliers and not all employees remain happy and employed by them ... and some just desire the attention that providing a leak gets them. Other than the HUGE leak of the design to Jalopnik more than a year before the release of the C7, there were by far, fewer individual leaks than we saw with the C6 - and fewer spy shots. Those we did get, had MUCH more cammo, than we saw with the C6.

Our earliest insights for the C6 came from suppliers. We saw a full size buck of the C6 that was at a supplier who was working on the spoilers and skirts for the Z06 BEFORE the base model was released. But we also saw close, clear spy shots of multiple C6s that had little more than tape hiding details as cammo.

BTW, for a 2017 release GM is probably close to wrapping up the design, if they haven't already - possibly still working in the wind tunnel on some of the fine points, but more likely only on the aero assists (spoilers). Chassis suppliers should have been working on and providing many "pre production" parts that are already on the mule.

Body panel suppliers? IMO, all of the panels will be CF so I'm guessing a single supplier (much easier to control security) who already has the design and is working on the molds and whatever is needed for the newest CF production techinics.

Regardless, GM will run mules to work out as many issues as possible in order to avoid exposure of the design.

TWO BIG differences for the C8 development that weren't around for the past generations:

Drone Copters
GoPro

You and I could by a $75 drone copter and strap a GoPro to it and get the pics we see of the C8 mule here. The trick is knowing where the C8 will be, so expect lots more high angle pics at the Lutz-ring and eventually at the Nürburgring.

BTW, Ford seemed to have done a very good job of keeping the new Ford GT design hidden. Admittedly, I haven't combed the net a lot for the FORD, but I couldn't find any spy shots of the car.
 
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