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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Just like Democrats praised GW when he did something that worked... like The Surge.
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WASHINGTON — President Obama drew praise from unlikely quarters on Monday for pursuing a risky and clandestine mission to kill Osama bin Laden, a successful operation that interrupted the withering Republican criticism about his foreign policy, world view and his grasp of the office.

Former Vice President Dick Cheney declared, “The administration clearly deserves credit for the success of the operation.” New York’s former mayor, Rudolph W. Giuliani, said, “I admire the courage of the president.” And Donald J. Trump declared, “I want to personally congratulate President Obama.”

As fleeting as it might prove to be, the positive tone stood in blunt contrast to the narrative Republicans have been working to build in the opening stages of the 2012 presidential campaign.

The argument that most potential Republican candidates have been making — that Mr. Obama is an indecisive leader, incapable of handling rapidly evolving events around the world — suddenly became more complicated. And the boost in stature for Mr. Obama, even if temporary, comes when a number of Republicans are deciding whether to commit themselves to the presidential race, and offered fresh evidence that he might be less vulnerable than his opponents thought.

The development came at a good time for Mr. Obama, who received the worst foreign policy rating of his presidency in a New York Times/CBS News poll last month, with 46 percent of respondents saying they disapproved of his handling of international affairs. But the implications for the president, who will visit the World Trade Center on Thursday, were impossible to predict.

The nation’s unemployment rate remains relatively high, and the economic recovery has yet to gain traction. High gasoline prices are pinching consumer budgets and eroding confidence. Seventy percent of Americans in the Times/CBS poll last month said the country was on the wrong track, and the White House is heading into what could be a bitter fight with Republicans about spending and raising the debt limit.

But at a minimum, Mr. Obama has been dealt another high-profile opportunity to try to position himself above the bitter partisan fray and offer a voice of reasoned compromise — a theme consistent with his strategy over the past six months of shedding Republican efforts to cast him as a partisan liberal out of touch with the country’s values.

“The world is safer; it is a better place because of the death of Osama bin Laden,” Mr. Obama said Monday. “Today, we are reminded that, as a nation, there’s nothing we can’t do when we put our shoulders to the wheel, when we work together, when we remember the sense of unity that defines us as Americans.”

The terrorist attacks that Bin Laden masterminded in New York and Washington a decade ago caused a significant shift in the nation’s politics. It remained to be seen to what extent his killing — dramatic as it was — would reorder the political landscape.

The developments came at a big moment in the race for the Republican presidential nomination, with new prospective candidates like Gov. Mitch Daniels of Indiana facing pressure to jump in. Jon M. Huntsman Jr., a former Utah governor who just returned from two years as ambassador to China to open a presidential run, found his efforts to trumpet his foreign policy experience immediately overshadowed.

“The president deserves and will receive credit for Bin Laden being killed on his watch,” said Mike DuHaime, a Republican strategist who advised Mr. Giuliani’s 2008 presidential bid. “Like Sept. 11 and its aftermath, this is a moment that transcends politics.”

Karl Rove, the Republican strategist for President George W. Bush, said that party’s crop of presidential aspirants would be wise to not be “churlish.” But he said he did not believe Bin Laden’s death would be a deciding issue in the 2012 campaign.

“This will tend to cause a lot of people to say we got our job done,” Mr. Rove said, noting a similar reaction when Saddam Hussein was captured in 2003. “This is a moment that will require him to say, ‘Here’s what needs to be done to prevail in Afghanistan, in Iraq, in Yemen, in the broader war on terror.’ ”

For Mr. Obama, the killing of Bin Laden represented a significant mark in his evolution as a national political leader, a career that has developed entirely in the decade since 9/11.

He was initially warned against seeking higher office because his name looked and sounded like Bin Laden’s. His campaign assertions that he would unilaterally act against “high-value terrorist targets” in Pakistan were met with charges of naïveté from rivals — including Hillary Rodham Clinton — for telegraphing such a move. The president’s advisers declined to discuss the political ramifications of the Bin Laden killing. But they said that they were mindful of the lessons of 1992, when the approval ratings of President George Bush rocketed after the Gulf War.

Samuel K. Skinner, the White House chief of staff at the time, remembered how Mr. Bush emerged with approval ratings of around 90 percent only to lose to Bill Clinton the following year.

“Everybody was shocked at how quickly things had dropped, precipitously,” Mr. Skinner said in an interview Monday. “Because of economic issues — and people’s perspectives of where the economy was — we were basically down south of 50 percent by October and November, and we were never able to recover.”

More recently, the bump in the polls that George W. Bush received after the capture of Saddam Hussein in 2003 evaporated within months.

In his first presidential campaign, Mr. Obama reaped considerable political benefit from his anti-Iraq war candidacy. In his second, he is hoping that he reaps the same level of benefit from his established role as a commander in chief who sent more troops to Afghanistan, authorized military strikes on Libya and signed off on the mission to kill Bin Laden.

John Ullyot, a former Marine intelligence officer who served as a Republican spokesman on the Senate Armed Services Committee, said the operation was “a gutsy call because so much could have gone wrong.”

“The fact that Obama approved this mission instead of the safer option of bombing the compound was the right call militarily,” Mr. Ullyot said, “but also a real roll of the dice politically because of how quickly it could have unraveled.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/03/us/politics/03obama.html?hp
 

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I agree that this opperation alone although gutsy and well implimented, will not by itself carry Obama to a second term. If the economy doesn't improve Obamas odds of reelection do not either.

I would argue though with karl Rove about the comparison between the capture of Sadam Husein and the killing of Osama Bin Laden. Sadam Husein was a bad guy to his people but he never attacked us. Bin Laden attacked us on our home soil...that made him 3000 times worse then Sadam, and a much more important target.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Osama was a chicken **** M/F that sent others to do his bidding while he hid behind women.

In that sense... they are the same. IMO.

Point being... the left is thankless ideology -no matter how great the accomplishment. They can not seem to bring themselves to congratulate the oppositions achievements the way the right is willing to.
 

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Osama was a chicken **** M/F that sent others to do his bidding while he hid behind women.

In that sense... they are the same. IMO.

Point being... the left is thankless ideology -no matter how great the accomplishment. They can not seem to bring themselves to congratulate the oppositions achievements the way the right is willing to.
Everyone got behind Bush after 911...everyone. It was only when he made stupid moves like letting Bin Laden get away at Torra Borra, and taking his eye off the ball in Afgahnastan by invading Iraq, that he started loosing the people who supported him after 911.


And seriously how can you compare a guy who never did anything to us to a man that planned and executed the bombing of two of our consulates, the bombing of the USS Cole, the destruction of the World Trade center and the murder of 3000 people, the attack on the Pentagone, bombings in the UK, Spain, and Germany.....Your attempt to equate these two people diminishes your entire credibility on the issue .

As for the surge....by then most people including many republicans were tired of the loses we had taken in a war that we shouldn't have been in, in the first place. We were all tired of plans that didn't work, and promises that were never met. In the end it was not so much the surge that worked but the capture hold and build strategy that Dr Rice had championed for years that realy took hold. Rummsfeld had opposed that strategy, and it was only when Bush finaly got rid of him that we could finaly start a more successfull strategy. Was there sucess? Yes. Was it to little too late??? Absolutly.
 

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I agree that this opperation alone although gutsy and well implimented, will not by itself carry Obama to a second term. If the economy doesn't improve Obamas odds of reelection do not either.

I would argue though with karl Rove about the comparison between the capture of Sadam Husein and the killing of Osama Bin Laden. Sadam Husein was a bad guy to his people but he never attacked us. Bin Laden attacked us on our home soil...that made him 3000 times worse then Sadam, and a much more important target.
I agree. I also think the public has noticed that this operation actually goes back to key info obtained in 2007 which has been constantly worked up until the present. This operation actually spans two presidencies. Obama deserves credit for his decision to go in, but the credit must be shared with George Bush, the CIA, JSOC and others involved in the operation. I think I give Obama the most credit for putting politics aside in his decision. He must have known that a major failure (like Carter's Iran operation) would have been a major blow to his reelection. To his credit, he set that aside and made the right choice.
 

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It was only when he made stupid moves like letting Bin Laden get away at Torra Borra, and taking his eye off the ball in Afgahnastan
do you really know/understand how Operation Anaconda's planning started, and what was finally approved? , and how it played out?
 

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do you really know/understand how Operation Anaconda's planning started, and what was finally approved? , and how it played out?
Opperation Anaconda was planned out in late January and February of 2002. Torra Borra was in december of 2001. Many lessons from Torra Borra were brought into the planning of opperation Anaconda such as cutting off the escape route into pakistan, and using our own troops to conduct the opperation with help from local militias rather than the other way around.

Since Torra Borra happened before planning for Opperation Anaconda even started I don't see why you bring it up. Opperation Anaconda was a great success and sent the Taliban running with thier tail between their legs and into hiding, but by then Osama Bin Laden was in Pakistan and out of harms way. After opperation Anaconda Bush took his eye off the ball and Invaded Iraq which allowed the taliban to regroup and recover and that is why we are still there today.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Do you believe he changed his mind in between 911 and his elections ? How about during his time as senator ?


Now where's your proof ?
 

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Do you believe he changed his mind in between 911 and his elections ? How about during his time as senator ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EhpKmQCCwB8

Now where's your proof ?
The video you posted has him speaking out against the war in Iraq....not the war in Afghanastan. As I said before Everybody was behind Bush after 911, until he took his eye of the ball and invaded Iraq. :crazy::crazy::crazy:

At 1:00 he even states enphaticaly that he supports the war in afghanastan.

Where is my proof....thanks for posting it for me. :nuts:
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Is he or is he not speaking out against the war in Iraq ? You said everyone "everyone" was behind Bush after 911...

Obama wasn't... neither were you.
 

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Is he or is he not speaking out against the war in Iraq ? You said everyone "everyone" was behind Bush after 911...

Obama wasn't... neither were you.
Dude I know you are realy upset that Obama did something realy good but you won't solve your problems by drinking this early in the morning....

As I said everyone was behind Bush after 911 until Bush took his eye off the ball and invaded Iraq.


Dude everyone can see what I wrote and everyone can see what you wrote in response...you are just making your self look stupid by attempting to change your argument in mid course. :crazy::crazy:
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Yes... they can see what you have written. Do I need to post up the support by a number...but not all of the democrats supporting the Iraq war, again ?

Did you see Obama supporting Bush during this time ? how about you ? Everybody supported Bush ?

How about during the surge ? Did the democrat's give Bush a thumbs up for the success of Iraq ? That is the premise of this thread...
 

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Got News for Everybody

Obama did not take out Osama bin laden

"THE NAVY SEALS AND CIA DID"

And know matter who was in office , Even if it was "Bob Barker of the price is right" Osama Still would have had his blown off





Obama had the fortune of being in the right place at the right time , AND THAT IS IT !

Obama couldn't figure his way out of a wet paper sack on his own , Truth be known

Lets not forget He has put future generations deeply in Debt, and failed at every turn as President of the united states
 

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Yes... they can see what you have written. Do I need to post up the support by a number...but not all of the democrats supporting the Iraq war, again ?

Did you see Obama supporting Bush during this time ? how about you ? Everybody supported Bush ?

How about during the surge ? Did the democrat's give Bush a thumbs up for the success of Iraq ? That is the premise of this thread...
This is what I said in post #4...
Everyone got behind Bush after 911...everyone. It was only when he made stupid moves like letting Bin Laden get away at Torra Borra, and taking his eye off the ball in Afgahnastan by invading Iraq, that he started loosing the people who supported him after 911.

So let me explain what I siad here like I was explaining it to a 1st grader....

Everyone got behind Bush after 911...everyone.

After 911 everyone supported Bush's plan to invade afghanastan. We all thought it was the right thinng to do because their was proof that Osama Bin Laden was there and had ordered the attacks of 911 from there. There was evidence of traing camps there for memebrs of al-Quiada, who had claimed responsability for 911.


It was only when he made stupid moves like letting Bin Laden get away at Torra Borra, and taking his eye off the ball in Afgahnastan by invading Iraq, that he started loosing the people who supported him after 911.

When Bush decided to invade Iraq thus removing important and needed supplies and personel from the efforts in Afghanastan, he lost many supporters, including most of the world who supported our invasion of Afghanstan, many democrats, including Obama, and many republicans who had supported Bush and his efforts in Afghanastan, including me.

I hope you get it now. :thumbsup:
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
The very fact that you have to go to these lengths to explain your self... shows how full of **** you are.

You made a generalization that was incorrect. Everyone was not behind Bush after 911. Most were... but most is not everyone. I was forced to correct you, again.
 

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The very fact that you have to go to these lengths to explain your self... shows how full of **** you are.

You made a generalization that was incorrect. Everyone was not behind Bush after 911. Most were... but most is not everyone. I was forced to correct you, again.
Bush's poll numbers imediatly after 911 were 92%. Politicaly speaking that is everbody. The vote to invade afghanastan was near unanymous if I remember correctly.

Your attempt to now split hairs after being proven totaly wrong is childish.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Did everyone support Bush after 911 ?

That was the premise of the article the I posted and you argued... there is nothing to split. You are the one taking liberties both prior and after you have been proven incorrect.

You act childish... them call others, childish.

You spin the facts... them accuse others of spinning the facts.

You regurgitate inconsistencies... and then argue those inconsistencies.
 

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First of all, Bin Laden is dead. That's a plus. Will it "end" terrorism? Of course not. Will it potentially increase the odds of a retaliatory strike? More than likely. The price of liberty is eternal vigilance.

Kudos to President Obama for hitting the "go" button on this operation. I'll be the first to admit I didn't think he had it in him, and I was wrong. He was the only one who had the final say, and he made the correct call. Burial of the body at sea was another good move - no "shrine" for a grave.

Now, having said all that, before we get TOO warm and fuzzy: The United States military mounted an unannounced incursion into a soverign country without their knowledge, using intelligence obtained from terrorists "illegally" detained at Guantanamo Bay, and we killed a foreign national. All of the very things the liberal Democrats have railed against during the past 40 years or more, yet now they want to claim the credit for the very systems they have openly and vindictively opposed for so long? NOW it's OK?

Hypocrites and liars, every one of them - they have proved it once again. And yet, the media will fawn all over the Obama administration for "getting" Osama Bin Laden, and no doubt fire up once again the "Bush, Cheney & Rumsfeld failed to do it" machine, even though it is in large part the very systems put in place by those men that enabled this day to occur. Systems that President Obama very vocally opposed.

Not easy sitting in the big boy chair, I guess. You tend to find out that those who occupied it before you may have known what they were doing after all. Of course, no liberal can or will ever admit this.

The more things change, the more they stay the same. Congratulations to our incomparable military, who actually planned and executed this mission. They are, once again, the only true heroes. While I have grave concerns about the coming months, as Al Queda cells all over the globe seek their revenge, I am confident that the systems put in place after 9/11 will continue to serve us well. We must all do our part as well. Stay safe, stay alert, remember we are still at war.
 
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