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So another stone is laid in the foundation...

BEIJING — Defense Secretary Robert M. Gates met his Chinese counterpart, Liang Guanglie, in Vietnam on Monday for the first time since the two militaries suspended talks with each other last winter, calling for the two countries to prevent “mistrust, miscalculations and mistakes.”

His message seemed directed mainly at officers like Lt. Cmdr. Tony Cao of the Chinese Navy.

Days before Mr. Gates arrived in Asia, Commander Cao was aboard a frigate in the Yellow Sea, conducting China’s first war games with the Australian Navy, exercises to which, he noted pointedly, the Americans were not invited.

Nor are they likely to be, he told Australian journalists in slightly bent English, until “the United States stops selling the weapons to Taiwan and stopping spying us with the air or the surface.”

The Pentagon is worried that its increasingly tense relationship with the Chinese military owes itself in part to the rising leaders of Commander Cao’s generation, who, much more than the country’s military elders, view the United States as the enemy. Older Chinese officers remember a time, before the Tiananmen Square protests in 1989 set relations back, when American and Chinese forces made common cause against the Soviet Union.

The younger officers have known only an anti-American ideology, which casts the United States as bent on thwarting China’s rise.

“All militaries need a straw man, a perceived enemy, for solidarity,” said Huang Jing, a scholar of China’s military and leadership at the National University of Singapore. “And as a young officer or soldier, you always take the strongest of straw men to maximize the effect. Chinese military men, from the soldiers and platoon captains all the way up to the army commanders, were always taught that America would be their enemy.”

The stakes have increased as China’s armed forces, once a fairly ragtag group, have become more capable and have taken on bigger tasks. The navy, the centerpiece of China’s military expansion, has added dozens of surface ships and submarines, and is widely reported to be building its first aircraft carrier. Last month’s Yellow Sea maneuvers with the Australian Navy are but the most recent in a series of Chinese military excursions to places as diverse as New Zealand, Britain and Spain.

China is also reported to be building an antiship ballistic missile base in southern China’s Guangdong Province, with missiles capable of reaching the Philippines and Vietnam. The base is regarded as an effort to enforce China’s territorial claims to vast areas of the South China Sea claimed by other nations, and to confront American aircraft carriers that now patrol the area unmolested.

Even improved Chinese forces do not have capacity or, analysts say, the intention, to fight a more able United States military. But their increasing range and ability, and the certainty that they will only become stronger, have prompted China to assert itself regionally and challenge American dominance in the Pacific.

That makes it crucial to help lower-level Chinese officers become more familiar with the Americans, experts say, before a chance encounter blossoms into a crisis.

“The P.L.A. combines an odd combination of deep admiration for the U.S. armed forces as a military, but equally harbors a deep suspicion of U.S. military deployments and intentions towards China,” David Shambaugh, a leading expert on the Chinese military at George Washington University, said in an e-mail exchange, referring to the People’s Liberation Army.

“Unfortunately, the two militaries are locked in a classic security dilemma, whereby each side’s supposedly defensive measures are taken as aggressive action by the other, triggering similar countermeasures in an inexorable cycle,” he wrote. “This is very dangerous, and unnecessary.”

From the Chinese military’s view, this year has offered ample evidence of American ill will.

The Chinese effectively suspended official military relations early this year after President Obama met with the Dalai Lama, the Tibetan religious leader, and approved a $6.7 billion arms sale to Taiwan, which China regards as its territory.

Since then, the Chinese military has bristled as the State Department has offered to mediate disputes between China and its neighbors over ownership of Pacific islands and valuable seabed mineral rights. And when the American Navy conducted war games with South Korea last month in the Yellow Sea, less than 400 miles from Beijing, younger Chinese officers detected an encroaching threat.

read continues in link....

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/12/world/asia/12beijing.html?_r=1&hp
 

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I'm in the U.S. and I'm not alarmed. In fact, nowhere in your article is the word "alarm" mentioned.

Easy on the paraphrasing there Chicken Little.
 

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I'm in the U.S. and I'm not alarmed. In fact, nowhere in your article is the word "alarm" mentioned.

Easy on the paraphrasing there Chicken Little.
:laughing: It's the title of the article, hunny. :thumbsup:
 

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If you're not the author of the article, the comment wasn't meant for you.

But if you're defending The New York Times...
 

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My first thought is if we can't beat a bunch of third-world punks with nothing on their side but hand-held weapons, how are we supposed to defeat a real military with high tech weaponry and surveillance? It's beginning to look like, short of a nuclear response, that conventional military weapons mixed with the political constraints of modern warfare, are pretty much impotent.
 

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My first thought is if we can't beat a bunch of third-world punks with nothing on their side but hand-held weapons, how are we supposed to defeat a real military with high tech weaponry and surveillance? It's beginning to look like, short of a nuclear response, that conventional military weapons mixed with the political constraints of modern warfare, are pretty much impotent.
I think the term is "Limited Warfare" and we have been practicing it since mid 1943:crazy:
 

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I think the term is "Limited Warfare" and we have been practicing it since mid 1943:crazy:

43? I wouldn't call those two bombs in '45 limited. :surprised But you are correct. Without a direct attack by a government on our homeland, all out war is a political impossibility in the modern world.
 

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43? I wouldn't call those two bombs in '45 limited. :surprised But you are correct. Without a direct attack by a government on our homeland, all out war is a political impossibility in the modern world.
Limited as in "letting" the Russians have Germany, allowing North Korea keep the south, letting the North Viet keep the south so on and so on:surprised

More food for thought, If we back Japan against China Pearl Harbor never would have happened
 

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I'm in the U.S. and I'm not alarmed.
:agree:

I am not one bit alarmed. They can reach as far a as where? Million men army of crispy critters. Your so bad you even glow in the dark! I want a shirt with a mushroom cloud that says "Made in America, continued testing in insert current irritating country here!”:D
 

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My first thought is if we can't beat a bunch of third-world punks with nothing on their side but hand-held weapons, how are we supposed to defeat a real military with high tech weaponry and surveillance? It's beginning to look like, short of a nuclear response, that conventional military weapons mixed with the political constraints of modern warfare, are pretty much impotent.
I have little doubt that we can defeat any standing army and clearly defined enemy. where we suck is when the enemy isn't easily defined and keeps switching sides.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
:agree:

I am not one bit alarmed. They can reach as far a as where? Million men army of crispy critters. Your so bad you even glow in the dark! I want a shirt with a mushroom cloud that says "Made in America, continued testing in insert current irritating country here!”:D
:laughing: Like Iraq? Who's only crime was using the weapons we gave them, to do the dirty little deeds we asked them too, then had the audacity to tell the US no, finally? :laughing:
 

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If our military had a real war and not some scripted escapade they would be unstoppable. In a real war, civilians die. Old men, women, children, dogs, cats, rats and pet squirrels all die in a real war. We just about bombed Germany into nothingness and entire cities were intentionally set ablaze. There was no warning. We are so afraid of our military's public image that we have tied their hands. An "enemy combatant" firing a RPG from behind a mother and infant son is pretty much guaranteed a free shot. Not in a real war. Sorry lady but your bad Karma gotcha.

We need to let our military do their jobs and these "wars" would not last anywhere near as long. They'll forgive us in due time. Germany is OK with us now. China could field a great big army against us but after the first day of a real war.....we'd outnumber them. If we were truly able to show them "shock and awe" then they would certainly be shocked and awed.

If our national civilian leadership would just say, "OK, we want to win this. What do you need?" our wars would end very quickly. They should change the rank of the President from Commander-in-Chief to that of spiritual advisor and we'd be a lot better off. If the decision is made to go to war.......Don't [email protected]#k it...lay the meat to it.
 

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China will continue to advance it's military technology. It will grow as a threat in the region. It's an economic powerhouse now due in part to the US and our trade practices. We slowly helped bankrupt the USSR as it tried to maintain an edge with us militarily. I remember many times out at see having a Soviet Bear flying by to check us out. Always an F-14 or 2 escorting it. Everywhere we went there was a Soviet frigate following us. China will start doing the same as we send ships into the region.
 

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China is upset over Taiwan and our waffling on the ownership of the island by China.
 

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China will continue to build it's Military

And it will be paid for in part by Americans lol


China and Chinese goods are Bad for America :nuts:

Not Smart

Bon
 

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China will continue to build it's Military

And it will be paid for in part by Americans lol


China and Chinese goods are Bad for America :nuts:

Not Smart

Bon
:agree: Not paid for in part, but mostly to wholly.
Not only are they buying our debt as our congress continues to 'give' it to them so they can fund thier next boondogle of pork, the Chinese are now seeking to buy up our domestic natural resources.
 
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