Alright. We need to walk this conversation back just a bit. We order 2-6 radiators from DeWitts every single month for the last ~9 years. Sometimes for a C2, Sometimes for a C6, Sometimes with the engine oil cooler(EOC), Sometimes in black ice. We had one a few years back that came to us with a hole in the box and it was damaged in shipping and we had to return it. That is THE ONLY problem we have experienced with a company we have been doing a great deal of business with for many years. Slag in a threaded hole sucks. But it happens. And to damn a good name brand because of an unremoved piece of flash?
Then you can run whatever radiator you want. Hell keep your current radiator. But at least you wont be trying to force something in your car that was made to fit a completely different car.
Whoa, easy there! Anytime I hear of problems with $$$ parts the first thing I want to know is it one in ten or one in ten-thousand. You have helped answer that question and I do appreciate your input. DeWitt is still very much on my probable list. As far as the F-body thing, was just running down another of those many rumors running around, most of which turn out not to be fact. Personally, I'm not that fond of OEM radiator swaps - they aren't that good in the first place!
Alright. We need to walk this conversation back just a bit. We order 2-6 radiators from DeWitts every single month for the last ~9 years. Sometimes for a C2, Sometimes for a C6, Sometimes with the engine oil cooler(EOC), Sometimes in black ice. We had one a few years back that came to us with a hole in the box and it was damaged in shipping and we had to return it. That is THE ONLY problem we have experienced with a company we have been doing a great deal of business with for many years. Slag in a threaded hole sucks. But it happens. And to damn a good name brand because of an unremoved piece of flash?
Slow down dude, i never damned dewitts. This was just a heads up for Zim. That same radiator is in my c3 and it seems to work ok after i cleaned up threads and flushed everthing. It didn't fix my overheating issue. I work hard for my money (just as you and others do I'm sure) and when i spend 640 for a radiator hell yeah I do have high expectations. I could've chosen to get a much lower priced champion or others for a much lower cost. I'm not going to go into the other issues i had dealing straight through them. Not my thread.
The wiring diagrams I did on mine were 1970. There may be some stuff that is the same but your year has more of the electronic do dads that mine doesn't.
The wiring diagrams I did on mine were 1970. There may be some stuff that is the same but your year has more of the electronic do dads that mine doesn't.
Yeah, I have quite a bit of tech data on the wiring and don't anticipate too many problems, especially since there are a lot of mods to the electrical system anyway. But I did run across 2 things that might be worth sharing.
A while back I ordered a laminated print of the entire wiring diagram on one poster sized sheet. I thought it might be handy to see the whole thing at once, plus the ad said it was in color. But when I got it it was in color alright: All blue! The wiring color codes were printed by the wire but the print is fuzzy and hard to read. Just to make sure it wasn't my eyes that were fuzzy I had my son take a look at it and yep, it's fuzzy! It didn't cost much so it was no big deal. Probably will still be handy.
The other thing is the factory service manual reprint that I ordered a couple years ago. It looks just like the original. In fact I have an original Service Manual for the 1982 that I bought back in 1982. The manuals have the schematics for the sub-systems printed out in colors that match the actual wiring. Before I took my 81 all apart I was troubleshooting the power windows and something about the schematics in the 81 reprint manual just wasn't making any sense.
Then I noticed that the reprint manual just used grey scales in the electrical section instead of actual color like the original manual. So I got out the original 82 service manual and flipped to the same window section (the 81 and 82 manual are virtually identical except for the Cross Fire circuits) and there it was: The yellow wires did not print in the reprint version anywhere! Once I figured that out everything fell into place. Thought I'd mention that JIC anyone is using a reprint manual, it's not a huge deal provided you know that any yellow wires will not show up in the reprint.
What do you do when you accidentally wipe all the fuse panel labeling off with solvent?? You spend a rainy afternoon putting them back on...
This isn't a big deal but it turned out better than I expected so thought I'd share. Used a Brother cable labeling tool with 1/4" white on black tape and the smallest font it had. Still had to trim the label width after printing but was actually pretty easy.
A little progress to report, set the body on the chassis for the first time since paint. I'm building up the harnesses, re-routing big cables, finding a place for everything, etc. The yellow tape is temporary, just keeping everything in place until I'm happy with the layout. Then I'll put it all in conduit and get it permanently mounted.
Been a long road with lots of interruptions but I'm starting to see some light at the end of the tunnel!!
Worked my way up to the point where I needed to install the accelerator. The one from my donor car (2010 Camaro SS) did not have a prayer of fitting. After some research I finally decided to go with the GM Performance P/N 19354328 LS3 ECU kit. It includes the wiring harness, ECU, accelerator, etc.
The accelerator and bracket it came with were a better fit, but it was a LONG way from being a bolt in fit. The bracket is intended to be mounted on a flat firewall, like many hot rods and tri-fives. But the C3 has a firewall that is anything but flat.
I modified the supplied bracket and fabricated several parts and doublers in order to get a good install. But it was a LOT more work than I thought it would be. In fact I'm not sure it would be possible on an assembled C3 due to such limited workspace.
For anyone attempting this install I would recommend doing a lot more research than I did! Surely there is an accelerator setup that is easier and still is compatible with the LS3 ECU. Here are a string of pictures showing what I did, they should be self explanatory.
I found a pretty trick firewall connector to pass wiring from the engine side to the cabin. Since I'm doing an LS3 swap with all modern gauges I didn't need the original engine wiring harness at all. But removing it leaves an ugly 2" hole in the firewall. Then I found this neat bulkhead connector from Maven Performance. I selected the single bulkhead connector with 4ea 12AWG pins, 19ea 16AWG pins, and 6ea 20AWG pins. The connector comes with the required male and female connector pins. This connector fits as if it were made for that ugly 2" hole. All I had to do was a little clean up sanding of the hole and it dropped right in. Then just drilled the 4 holes and secured it in place with the provided hardware. Since the mounting plate is what attaches to the firewall, the cabin side of the connector can be accessed by removing the large hex nut on the engine side of the firewall. The cabin connector can then be pulled out for any changes to the wiring and the mounting plate stays in place. The connector is keyed so it will go back in the same orientation and will not rotate.
This connector uses the Deutsch pins/sockets. The Deutsch pin style, both solid and stamped, is becoming more commonplace in newer cars. The solid pin style is used with this, and many other, connectors. This particular firewall bulkhead connector is completely sealed and weather tight.
This is what you get, the mounting plate, the cabin side connector, and the 1/4 turn engine side connector. It comes with all the pins necessary for all 29 connections. Other pin configurations are available.
I also ordered the boots both straight and 90 degree. They are not heat shrink but fit the connector quite well. The plastic pins are for the unused pins.
This next part is important. The pins are mil-spec like the Amphenol or Cannon connectors on military equipment. Accordingly, they require a specific crimping tool. I spent over 35 years working for the US Air Force (as a civilian, not active duty) and have a pretty good background on the engineering/technical side of aviation electronics. If you want to use these types of connectors whether they be mil-spec or not, I STRONGLY recommend buying, borrowing, or renting the correct Deutsch crimping tool. It's expensive I know, around $260 for the solid pin tool used here, but you will not be sorry in the end. I have seen people try to get by with the Chinese clones but they invariably wind up buying the real thing. So save your money, get the good tool the first time. Many of the Packard 56 and 59 style pins can be successfully crimped with the "all in one" crimpers with the exchangeable jaws, although it can be a bit tedious. Once you use this crimping tool for solid Deutsch pins, you will never go back! You can crimp a pin with 100% success faster than you can read this last sentence. Plus, the Deutsch connector pins are becoming more and more common on newer cars. They have a variety of plastic shells instead of this 1/4 turn bulkhead connector, but the pins can be crimped with this tool as long as you use the solid pins. Do a little research, Maven Performance is a good place to start. The crimper below is a Deutsch model HDT-48-00 and will handle 12AWG - 20 AWG.
Been a while since I posted any progress reports. Been doing a lot, but it's one of those stages where you do a whole lot of work but it doesn't really show that much! I am almost finished with all the wire harness fabrication, just a few loose ends (literally) to wrap up. The Vintage Air is all wired up, new sensor wiring/harnesses are in place for the Dakota Digital HDX control unit, main power busses are in place (fed by the GM Performance ECU) and the body harnesses are in place. The original wiring bulkhead connector is completely rebuilt with unused circuits removed or repurposed. Fuel system is complete, I will do a final test to ensure no fuel leaks before the body is buttoned down for keeps. I'll probably get that done in the next few days. I might actually get this done after all!!
I plan to join the body/chassis next week, hopefully for the last time! The cabin rewiring is about 95% done, will wrap up a few circuits that I can't complete until the body and chassis are one. Here's a little "before and after"...
I decided to go with a Dakota Digital HDX gauge package. Since all the transducers connect to a control module the underdash wiring is a lot simpler. Below is the module, speedo/tach cluster, and console gauges. A single, small cable connects all instruments to the module.
This is the firewall connector I used. The left side is the engine side and on the right is the cabin side. The connector passes the accelerator harness along with the gauge transducers.
Since everything is easy to get to with the body off, I decided to open the rear steam vents on the LS3. I used Earls steam vent adapters, then made up the .250 stainless tubing for the front and connection to the rear steam vents. On the rear, I used some Russell stainless Pro-flex hose I had laying around. I could have just as easily made a rigid stainless line. The rigid line is a lot smaller, but I don't think it will be an issue. FWIW, this probably wasn't a critical requirement since the LS3 is stock. I do understand the reasoning for opening up the back vents, and at this stage it isn't a big deal to open up the back ones. But on a stock or slightly modified engine already installed I wouldn't recommend it. Kind of hard to get to everything.
The VA Front Runner is installed for keeps this time. Next up: Body meets Frame!!
Your detailed parts descriptions make me almost feel like i`m in your garage and help wrenching !
Though i liked the big pictures even more than the thumbnails this is big fun to watch.
Thanks for supplying
Everything is looking really good! I’ve been away from the forums and my own ‘81 LS3 swap for a bit while we finished part of our basement over the winter. I also put the Dakota Digital gauges in my setup and love them… they feel like good quality and well made. I got my car running in the fall enough to get it to an exhaust shop and get the first 150 miles on it. I found I had a tremendous amount of heat coming through the floor boards and firewall even with lizard skin applied to the exterior so I removed what interior I had in and have just got around to putting in Thermo-Tec’s Thermo Guard FR on the interior of the firewall and floor. I plan on putting some form of heat shield on the exhaust too and hope this combination solves my heat issue.
I am now revisiting and correcting a few things I cobbled together to get it up and running before winter. I like what you did with the Earl’s steam adapters… they must be a new product as I didn’t run cross them when I hooked my steam vents. Keep the posts coming!
I hope you guys are all doing well during this crisis. I love the way this car is coming out and I really, really dig the color. But I am here now to share my bad thoughts about the GM filter/regulator. This was a relic of the LS1. And not just 97-04. Because in truth even some C5 cars had already upgraded to the C6 fuel system. This is because 350hp was a lot of demand to push through a filter under pressure. And also there was a realization that with such large fuel injectors if the particles can pass through the sock in the tank they will blow right through the injectors. At high flow rates that filter regulator will do a much better job at keeping 58psi between the pump ant the filter but the line running to the rail will be notably less. This is why by 2005 ALL corvettes switched to the new fuel system without a filter. And that was for the 6.0L LS2. It is a joke to think that filter regulator will happily fuel the 6.2L 450hp LS3. You need to swap the filter regulator for just a regulator. Be it from FAST or Aeromotive or w/e but you need to remove the restriction between the regulator and the fuel rail if you hope to fuel over 400hp worth of fuel.
Everything is looking really good! I’ve been away from the forums and my own ‘81 LS3 swap for a bit while we finished part of our basement over the winter. I also put the Dakota Digital gauges in my setup and love them… they feel like good quality and well made. I got my car running in the fall enough to get it to an exhaust shop and get the first 150 miles on it. I found I had a tremendous amount of heat coming through the floor boards and firewall even with lizard skin applied to the exterior so I removed what interior I had in and have just got around to putting in Thermo-Tec’s Thermo Guard FR on the interior of the firewall and floor. I plan on putting some form of heat shield on the exhaust too and hope this combination solves my heat issue.
I am now revisiting and correcting a few things I cobbled together to get it up and running before winter. I like what you did with the Earl’s steam adapters… they must be a new product as I didn’t run cross them when I hooked my steam vents. Keep the posts coming!
Goldata81 I'm very interested to hear of the heat problem you encountered. I'm at a good place right now to take some preventive action. I have a supply of Dynamat but have not installed it yet. My plan was to use the Dynamat inside and fab or adapt some heat shields of some sort over the pipes. But your experience is making rethink things. Maybe I should use something like Thermo Guard instead of the Dynamat? Does your LS have headers or stock exhaust manifolds? My plan is to retain the stock manifolds for the moment and fabricate the rest of the exhaust in a manner that I can adapt to headers as a future upgrade. If you get a chance, sure would like to see some pics of your exhaust system!
I hope you guys are all doing well during this crisis. I love the way this car is coming out and I really, really dig the color. But I am here now to share my bad thoughts about the GM filter/regulator. This was a relic of the LS1. And not just 97-04. Because in truth even some C5 cars had already upgraded to the C6 fuel system. This is because 350hp was a lot of demand to push through a filter under pressure. And also there was a realization that with such large fuel injectors if the particles can pass through the sock in the tank they will blow right through the injectors. At high flow rates that filter regulator will do a much better job at keeping 58psi between the pump ant the filter but the line running to the rail will be notably less. This is why by 2005 ALL corvettes switched to the new fuel system without a filter. And that was for the 6.0L LS2. It is a joke to think that filter regulator will happily fuel the 6.2L 450hp LS3. You need to swap the filter regulator for just a regulator. Be it from FAST or Aeromotive or w/e but you need to remove the restriction between the regulator and the fuel rail if you hope to fuel over 400hp worth of fuel.
Very interesting Autowiz, and makes a lot of sense to me. That must be why I see so many LSx swaps with just a regulator. I'll probably leave the filter/regulator in place for the moment, at least until I can get the car moving under it's own power. It shouldn't be a big problem to change to a regulator only. I'm not that crazy about where I installed the filter/regulator anyway. I appreciate your input! Reminds me of one of my favorite old sayings: "Learn from other peoples mistakes... You won't live long enough to make them all yourself!"
Buttttttt?!?!? What about the dynamat and carpet with heavy juke? This spacing here will drag on the carpet when everything is together and at best cause premature wear. And some people put floor mats on their carpets. Maybe 1.5" - 2"? Both ways? Then once everything is together there might still be a bit of a gap? I mean that gas pedal doesn't need to social distance from the other 2 pedals like it has. Does that DBW pedal have the Covid-19? lol.
Buttttttt?!?!? What about the dynamat and carpet with heavy juke? This spacing here will drag on the carpet when everything is together and at best cause premature wear. And some people put floor mats on their carpets. Maybe 1.5" - 2"? Both ways? Then once everything is together there might still be a bit of a gap? I mean that gas pedal doesn't need to social distance from the other 2 pedals like it has. Does that DBW pedal have the Covid-19? lol.
Good point autowiz. I had laid the original carpet (no floor mat) under and beside the DBW pedal. I had adequate clearance, but of course the new carpet and backing will undoubtedly be thicker. The picture really doesn't give much info about the distance to the floor. In reality, the 3/4" beneath the DBW pedal is measured right at the bottom of the pedal. It gets considerably more clearance as you move up the pedal. As far as side clearance, I can't move the mount any further to the left. I think the clearances will be ok, but if not I can always tweak the "arm" the pedal is mounted to.
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